Sparta-Morgan Relations

[Maniac]

In order to be able to research IntInt next, they have to:

a) switch to SocPsych next. We then give them SocPsych & DocLoy and then they can switch to IntInt and research it.

or of course

b) switch to whatever tech next. Then we give them DocLoy, and they change research, losing half their research points.

In any case, in order for them to be able to research IntInt, we might already have to give them two techs (SocPsych & DocLoy). Would those two alone not already be sufficient payment for IntInt and our destruction of their attorney (if they they mention this of course)?

[Snoddasmannen]

Originally posted by Maniac
In any case, in order for them to be able to research IntInt, we might already have to give them two techs (SocPsych & DocLoy). Would those two alone not already be sufficient payment for IntInt and our destruction of their attorney (if they they mention this of course)?

Maybe we should suggest it and get the ball rolling. Getting one level 1 and one level 2 tech seems better than a single level 3 tech, so we could even suggest a small sum of credits to go in our favour, just to get the ball rolling, and hope we wind up with the deal you suggested.

It think it is rather important that we get IntInt before the Gaians/Angels do, even if it means fattening up the already chubby Morgans.

And hey, aren't the extra police powers kinda' neat for us to have as well? Do people use them in MP games?

[Googlie]

I posted this in the Embassy to get the ball rolling:

Posted by Googlie in the Embassy

Dear Mr. Mead:

We are currently researching Intellectual Integrity, as we have alluded to in prior communications, However, given that somehow we have managed to become the technology leaders on Chiron, our research rate is, perforce, pathetic.

The Corporation will imminently finish its research into Adaptive Ecomomics.

Might the Corporation be willing to work with the Federaion towards both our factions acquiring Intellectual Integrity? This would likely require the Corporation to commence researching Social Psych after completing Adaptive Economics, and our sending to the Corporation the 2 technologies of Social Psych and Doctrine: Loyalty, whereupon you could change to Intellectual Integrity and pass to us upon completion.

This would then - for us - complete the research that we have deemed to be on our critical path (opening the way for us to complete the Citizens' Defense Force which you recall from our Ethical Calculus deal was a crucial component in our strategy development) and clear the way for a more detailed joint approach to researching Synthetic Fossil Fuels and Doctrine: Air Power to be followed by Neural Grafting and Mind Machine Interface.

Is there interest on the part of the Corporation?

Lieutenant-Colonel Googlie

[Googlie]

How about (before their turn) posting this in the Embassy:

Proposed posting to the Embassy, Captains' Log thread

Captain Primus Pilus stroked his beard thougthfully as he pondered the transcript of the secure commlink message from Lt. Col Maniac.

"Poor bastards," he muttered under his breath. "I wonder if Mr. Moneypenny was among them"

"Sir?" asked his Exec, Lieutenant Adams.

"Morgan Eudaimonics" came the gruff reply. "Lost their Defense Attorneys when Googlie's covert operations team went to work. Moneypenny had talked so proudly of them. A compromise, he said. Fitted with flak jackets, and doubling as police as well as psi-controllers, to save the disgruntlement that Morganites get when they see military in their bases - or even worse, away from them. But armed only with truncheons and their own wits.

"Moneypenny said that a new class, with synthmetal body armour, had been developed, but they weren't yet in service at Eudaimonics."

"Would they have survived the attempted infiltration if they'd had that body armour then?" asked his Exec.

"No," Pilus replied. "Googlie never does anything by half measure. That'd have been an Elite team he'd sent, all fired up with this new notion of the Fundamental right of the Spartan Federation to act as the only Global superpower. They wouldn't have stood a chance."

The exec grunted in sympathy. He'd come to quite like Mr. Moneypenny, arguing as they had done in the short Chiron evenings, over the relative merits of Wealth versus Power. He knew that Moneypenny had been an integral part of the Morgan covert operations structure himself, and, like his Captain, just hoped that he'd somehow survived the infiltration casualties.

"I just hope that this doesn't degenrate into a vendetta with them," said the Exec.

"I hope not, too," the Captain replied. "But I think that both our factions have too much to offer each other for it to degenerate to that. Either Morgan will send their 'Gators our way - and the Lt. Col is surely prepared for that - or, as Moneypenny said, they'll soon be Planetary Governor anyway, so will have infiltration on everyone without needing to expend probe units trying."

"But lets get the maps out and see where we fit into this new Modo Doctrine the Lt Colonel talks about"

They turned on their heels, and went below, to the Hunter's command room.

[Modo44]

Makes us look soooo innocent in this killing. And has the "Modo Doctrine" included. I just love it.

[Snoddasmannen]

Brilliant piece of story-telling
We can only hope that the Morgans will take better to this than the Gaians took our roleplaying there

[Googlie]

Posted it!!

[Googlie]

Morgan has responded:

Posted by Mead in the Embassy

Where do we go from here - after the Spartan Probe

The title says it all.

The Corporation is shocked, saddened, and disappointed.

Not only were we probed during the Treaty, but one of our valuable probe units was killed in the process.

We never saw it coming.

What should we do now?


We have several questions.

How much will we be compensated for the loss of the Probe?

How will we given given assuarances that future unfriendly acts will not be conducted against the Corporation?

How will we be granted the benefit of a return infiltration of the Junta?

How can we continue an association with the Junta unless we have clear promises from the Junta that no Junta units will approach our borders (to be within striking distance of our cites or territory) without prior notice to the Corporation. How can we continue association with the Junta without a clear promise from the Junta that no hostile military actions be taken agains the Corporation. How can we continue any association with the Junta without a clear promise from the Junta that no probe actions be carried out that are directed against or are detrimental to the Corporation?

We profited from our assocition with the Junta and we had hoped that the Junta profited from association with the Corporation.

We had hoped to continue to mutually profit from association with the Junta. I still do.

Picking up the pieces, in a hope to continue the relationship, I propose:

Payment of Probe (I am not sure but I am told this Probe cost 50ECs) for the loss of the Defensive Probe. This can be withheld from future payments to Sparta.

Return infiltration of Sparta by a Corporation unit. Until such time that can be accomplished we could enter into a Pact to ensure both Sparta have equal infiltration.

Obtain clear Spartan promise of no future Probe (or military) action during the remaining 9 years of the treaty.

Mead
CDO, Morgan Corp.

PS
I like being open to negotiation, but there are those who find it difficult for us to continue sharing profits with you, and funneling money to you when we see it so clearly used against us. There are those within the Corporation who state that your Probe action, with the resulting loss of life, has breached the treaty between us. I hope that the Treaty can be salvaged. There are those who say we now owe you nothing and that anything else we share or send to you will only be used against us. I hope that we can continue the work that was so beneficial before.

I agree that the actions of the Junta have harmed the Corporation and that there are damages that should be compensated, but I feel that the Corporationa and the Junta mutually benefit from working together. Without the mutual cooperation I believe we both will fail.

Please let me know if I am wrong in hoping.

[Googlie]

I propose we send the following initial response:

To Morgan Corporation:

The Junta is considering your communication, but as an intitial response we point out the following:

With the benefit of hindsight (or infiltration) we would have been better off landing at Red Fungus Resort. The Corporation would never have known of our infiltration (the mere act of infiltration does not trigger the automatic Vendetta clause), so the only unfriendly act was the destruction of the probe defender at Eudaimonics.

(We believe that if your 'Gator boats investigated one of our coastal bases, and found it without a probe defender, you would have taken exactly the same action against the Federation (with us running Fundy the destroy and infiltrate option would probably not have been viable for the Corporation to attempt)

While we (obviously) did not ask the Corporation for permission to infiltrate, we did give advance notification before the turn reached Morgan (see the logs of the SCC Hunter)

We would like to maintain friendly relations with the Corporation, and the Junta will discuss the subjects of reparations for the relatives of the deceased defense attorney, a mutual infiltration treaty - or a Pact - as well as supporting a Morgan bid for Planetary Governor and other such joint initiatives.

My recommendations to the Junta will be Morgan-friendly, but much, however, will hinge on whether the Corporation will support the Federation's drive for the CDF, which we believe is crucial to ridding Planet of the Hive menace.

(and as an aside, in the interest of frankness, there are those within the Junta who would see the cessation of technology payments as a "causus bellus" - leading to Vendetta. I think that they can be convinced that peace, technology trading and commerce are preferable to war and destruction)

We will reply more formally after the junta has deliberated.

[Googlie]

Gor a PM from Mead:

PM to Googlie from Mead

What's Happening

Googlie:

Can you tell me what's happening?

I think we can do some real good work together but I am not sure what your intentions are.

Please let me know what you want to do.

Mead

To which I replied:

reply PM from Googlie to Mead

RE: What's Happening

I've just posted your message (from the Embassy) in our Forum, together with my suggested reply.

With the benefit of hindsight, we'd have been better off infiltrating at Red Fungus Resort - then you'd never have known (but we believed that you would have probe defenders in all your coastal bases)

We'll prolly offer reparations (we calculate them at 52 ec's) but I can't see the Junta agreeing to parallel infiltration. (If one of your 'Gators had found a Sparta base without a probe defender, you'd have infiltrated us without our knowing, and tell me honestly - would you have asked permission in advance? Would you have told us of your success? Would you have then allowed us to probe you? I doubt it)

I can prolly convince the Junta to support a Morgan run for Governorship (you and Yang would now be the 2 candidates, as you have overtaken Lal) after Yang gets all the commlinks.

We'd like to stay friends and trading partners. I think we can agree not to stealtech or show hostile intent for the duration of our current treaty - but Morgan assisting us to get the CDF would be huge for future good relations between us (We see the Hive as being a major threat in this game. The Gaians are pooh-poohing our fears, but they don't share the long border with Yang that we do, and their victories have been with a marauding mindworm against Hive colony pods. (They might change their tune when those legions of Impact rovers call on the nearest Gaian base). So getting perimeter defenses up and running for us is crucial.

I still think that we can - together - control this game so that the outcome rests with just our two competing philosophies - and it'd make a fine endgame with Morgan going for a transcendence or an economic victory while we try to go the world domination or supreme leader route (with maybe a sniffing chance at transcendence).

But that's just my opinion. There are others who believe that a Gaian-Sparta axis makes more sense, while yet a third believes that we should change to POLICE and Pact with the devil.

Anyway, the Junta will be discussing events and we'll get back formally thru the Embassy, but I'm hoping that we can get to "business as usual" with the only difference being that we have you infiltrated for a few turns before you get infiltration on us.

Googlie

[Snoddasmannen]

I'm happy with the way they took it. I think they are more frightened than angry. They know we can mess up their plans, and that we could also help them win, and now they get this, which is some indication that we are going the wrong way.

Your reply to Meads PM will calm them down, which could be either good or bad

They don't have much in the way of counter-threats, but they do threaten to suspend license payments. That would be really bad, and could easily spiral out of control. If we need them for cooperation in the future (I think we do) we should make sure they are properly compensated for the loss of their probe, but no more than that. No pact or free infiltration imo.

So to keep them happy, I suggest we send them the cash right away if we have it, and if not that we let them dock it straight from the licensing fees for a period of years. I prefer the first one since it emphasizes the "business as usual" approach.

[Modo44]

Remember that they did see it coming. They were producing those defense attorneys, right? Good you didn't point it out though - calling the bluff might make them angry and scared. Because they are scared already, that's obvious.

[Googlie]

A PM reply from Mead:

PM from Mead to Googlie

Googlie

There is a lot of hurt on our side and not much in the way of trust.

The plan you offer may go a long way towards healing wounded feelings.

As I understand it, you offer to compensate 52 ECs for the lost probe (we would withold these funds from the current and future payments until the loss is made up), promise to take no action military or probe against or harmful to the Corporation until at least 2161, and support (vote for) Morgan in its run for Governorship.

If this is what you intend then please post it in the embassy.

Mead

They're milking this for all its worth. (Let's face it, if we had infiltrated at Red Fungus Resort, they'd never have been any the wiser.

I suggest:

We offer the 52 ec's credit, non-aggression for a decade (it'll take us at least that long to deal with Zak and the ensuing inevitable war with Lal) and governor voting support (plus, during that decade they'll be churning out defensive units, to the detriment of their colony pod expansion and base infrastructure)

but

They agree to make Int Int their next research goal and deliver it to us as soon as researched (we'll send them Soc Psych and Doc Loyalty - that'll slow their research rate from its current every 4 years to somewhat longer, so we can't specify a delivery date)

So there's something in it for both of us.

[Googlie]

Reply from us:

I toughened it slightly, making it a tad more threatening:

Posted by Googlie in the Embassy

The Junta has met and these are the results of our deliberations

While we understand the Corporation's annoyance at the loss of a valuable unit, we draw the Corporation's attention to our Spartan Battle Manual, ( which we believe has a Corporation counterpart - the Morgan Business Manual) page 130, which reads (our italics):

Probe teams cannot attack other units directly, but they can battle one another to the death. Probe Team combat is based on the morale of the combatants.
Probe Teams can attack other teams even in squares containing other units. Since Probe Teams have no "official" existence, destroying another faction's Probe Teams does not violate a treaty or pact.

Accordingly we offer the Corporation one of 2 alternatives:

1) In the spirit of the Manual, continue as if nothing has happened

or

2) The Sparta Federation will:

> offer the Corporation a 50 ec credit against treaty payment obligations, to recognize the loss of the Defense Attorney,
> guarantee not to initiate any hostile action for the ten year duration of this current treaty,
> transfer the technologies of Social Psych and Doctrine: Loyalty to the Corporation
> in exchange for which the Corporation will deliver to the Federation as soon as possible the technology of Intellectual Integrity.

With either of those alternatives, The Federation will sympathetically consider a request - backed by suitable inducements - to support a vote for Morgan as Planetary Governor

(Of course, a third option - vendetta - is always an alternative open to the Corporation)

We look forward to learning of your choice in this matter

Lieutenant-Colonel Googlie

[Googlie]

I've just opened the 2150 turn to have a look at things.

They have taken 27 ec's credit:

extracted from the Embassy post by jtsisyoda

Enclosed in the turn (2150) you will find 0 ECs, but 27 ECs credit toward attorney fees. This is 40% of the Morgan Bonus ECs we received in trade with you, plus 8 for the installment of ET and GS trade, plus 15 ec's as the second half of the PK commlink price.

They also have changed their research to Social Psych, so it certainly l;ooks like they have chosen option 2 (but nothing - yet - in the Embassy re the actual proposals, just the revenue update)

Also, they have changed production at nearly all their bases to probeteams!!

I'll post some screenies later.