Jan III Sobieski scenario

[GhostOfDisco]

Sure, I'd love to see them.

[curtsibling]

Cool, just let me know what you need!

[GhostOfDisco]

Cool, just let me know what you need!

Well, I think I need:
Coastal Fortress
Workshop (maybe)
Iron forge
17th century equivalent of a stock exchange or "Loaner" (The Exchange representing the possiblity of Polish nobility/merchants/etc getting into investment and all that instead if sticking to the grain trade)
17th century equivalents of granary and "farmland" (i.e. "current" agricultural innovations)

Also, if it's not too much trouble, could you please make a set of RR suburbs in the "generic 17th century European" style?

[curtsibling]

I'll get onto those very soon, Ghost!

No worries!

[GhostOfDisco]

Still wondering on how to solve the "Leo upgrade" problem...

Well, playing civ2units and guessing the CS Garrison units in Richmond help explain why the city took so long to take, I thought of making a "strong garrison" unit for Turkish cities that historically took a while to take (Buda, Constantinople (true, the city was never beseiged during this time period, but...), and Kamieniec after the Turks took it), so I whipped this up today.
The guy in front is a kneeling Janissary musketeer, compiled from a number of fairline units. The other guy is a Janissary officer whose outfit is derived from a picture in the Osprey Vienna book.

Making these guys has made me wonder if the regular Janissary guy needs and overhaul. Maybe he does. Maybe.

[GhostOfDisco]

Could anyone help me with how Leo's Workshop (Polish Sejm in this scenario) updates units? I want to have both the Pikeman and Musketeer units updated to the Infantry unit, but when I make them both obsolete with "Infantry Tactics" only one of the units is updated, the other one stays the same (even though its build order upgrades). I know that you can have a number of units upgraded via the Gunpowder tech (in the vanilla game, having said tech will cause all your infantry units to become Musketeers) but I'd rather not have all my barracks sold, which the tech likes to do.

Does anyone have any advice for me on this?

[techumseh]

St. Leo's upgrades units which have the same domain (air, land, sea), and role (attack, defend, etc.) and whose obsolete tech is the same as the new unit's pre-req. If that's not working, then I'm not sure why.

[GhostOfDisco]

I tried what you said and it works! Now I got a unit slot and gave some Turkish cities strong garrisons (and some Tartar cities too, lest the Muscovites steamroll over them.

One question I've been wondering - in civ2units' ACW thread tecumseh mentioned the different roles for each unit, which helped in my upgrading both Musketeers and Pikeman to Infantry, and so I changed most of the units to "attack" so that the AI would use them aggressively.

I'm wondering about making some of those units "3" so that they're not needlessly wasted in senseless attacks (it might be good for Janissaries, who tend to waste themselves during the sieges of Kamieniec and Vienna), but there are times when I make the Turks and Tartars attack, and when I want them to attack I want them to attack! I want to face their units in the field, not simply fight off their artillery attacking my city and see nothing else because the AI has holed up all the infantry and such into the nearest city. What do you think I should do?

[techumseh]

Unfortunately, the only way to ensure a unit will attack is to give it a '0' role. Using air superiority ('3') means the unit will generally only attack when it has a good chance to win. There is no guarantee it will attack.

You might create an identical unit with the '0' role, that appears at the right spot via events, when you really want them to attack.

[GhostOfDisco]

And for some eye candy, here's some revised Danish soldiers I whipped up the other day...

[civ2units]

Great units you´ve painted

How long do we have to wait until the scen is ready for playtest?

[GhostOfDisco]

When will the playtest come out? Not sure, there are still a lot of things to be done, but I do plan on releasing a playtest when the "basic" parts of the scenario are done (i.e. all the events and such are done, but the more complex things (the internal political events, pedia entries, etc.) aren't.

Hope that answers your question (well, it sorta does).

On another note, I've got a problem - to make sure the barbs don't have Polish-style cities, I moved the Polish city style to the Far East Slot and gave the Classical slot to the barbs. Now, although everything is fine in my save games, when I save the game as a scenario and start from there - even after using CivTweak to ensure that the Poles have "Far Eastern" architecture - when I play the Polish civ, I get barb-style cities!
How do I fix this? (I think the answer may lie in the rules.txt folder, but still, your advice would be appreciated...)

[civ2units]

Yes, you have to change the rules.txt file. If you would like to see the correct city styles for the Polish civ you have to change one thing in the @LEADERS row.

For example:

@LEADERS
Caesar, Livia, 0, 1, 2, Romans, Roman,...

You have to change the third number (they are for the city styles), you can choose from 0-3, in your example you have to change it to 2 for the Eastern city style.

[GhostOfDisco]

In honor of the anniversary of the Battle of Vienna, I've decided to release a playtest of the scenario!
Main files
(I'll upload the sounds sometime this weekend ... currently Sleague is having trouble uploading them! )

[AGRICOLA]

I'm giving the scen a try. After a couple of hours of going over its details, here are a few comments.

Do change the unit name John Sobieski to Jan Sobieski. There is no reason to use the anglicized version of his name.

I found that the scen loaded very slowly, 2+ minutes, possibly because the virus checker (AVG) was checking every step of loading the events.

Given that this is an alpha version, the descriptions of civilization advances could do with some editing in order to make them more descriptive of what the techs accomplish. There also seem to be some dead end techs that seem to acomplish nothing. Similarly, government forms like Imperialism and Sultanate have no descriptions.

Excepting the changes I make to all scens, the graphics are generally excellent.

I have some doubts about the future of the Polish economy. It looks like a long, slow development to something that can support a large army.

Please edit GAME/@PRODUCTION to width=550 so that there is no overwriting in the City Window "What shall we build?" screen.


The first turn went surprisingly well after the initial Tartar onslaught. Aggressive patrolling along the roads to the southeast located and eliminated 4-5 stacks of Tartar cav. Alliances were made with two other civs and techs were exchanged. Unneeded improvements were sold off and city walls rush built in key cities.

Excepting a few city improvements and some Pikemen, most cities were set to produce Cossack Storozhas. This unit appears to be an incredible bargain when compared to the similar Pacerni.

Cossack Storozhas____A/D/Mv/HP/FP/COST = 7/3/4/2/2/20 + all roads
Pacerni______________A/D/Mv/HP/FP/COST = 7/3/4/3/2/100

Did you intend this?


This scen looks very interesting with Poland having to fight desperately for its survival from its historical situation of being surrounded by enemies on all sides.