Diplogame Rules and Victory Discussion

[Robert]

Passwords don't work anyway.
If the game continues 1 turn with AI controll, the password of that civ is gone.

Regarding city razing: we should just turn that off.

[LzPrst]

passwords is a NO-NO! we are all honorable men (and woman).

as for city razing. it should be allowed. but remember there are consequences. you'll be considered an atrocity-committing monster. and in BtS citizens take up arms after having their city razed. (at least in SP).

it is also very rare that someone would want to raze a city. it should be allowed, but of course considered a horrible act of cruelty and barbarism.

and just to make sure that people dont use razing as a means of reducing rivals by attacking huge cities, we could say is that no city over the size of 12 should be razed.


remember, cities have been razed historically, Carthage, (by Rome) Samarkand (by the Mongols), and so on. it is not common, but it did happen. and it should be allowed in the game.

If for nothing else, then remember this, during the expansion phase, often empires will discuss resettlement of newly built cities if there is an issue. razing must be allowed, but should be used extremely rarely.

[LzPrst]

and we should get the players we can get. likely we wont have more than 9 anyway. and if we end up numbering 10, then I feel we shouldnt demand that someone not play. let's set 9 as a desired number, but allow ourselves to be flexible. remember, a game takes 6 months, and if you're not in, then you're not in until the next one starts, half a YEAR later. which sux. and we've shown that we can only have one game going at a time, there's just not enough players for 2 simultaneous games.
so, 9 is our ideal number, but we make our own rules here and as such we should be allowed to bend our rules when it is to our benefit.

rules are made to make you think about what you're doing. they should not be so inflexible that they dictate our actions to be against common sense.



and as for me subbing. can't be done until after christmas. I dont have a laptop, I dont many people in the western hemisphere whom I could borrow a computer from. and I don't have civ with me. believe me, I'd like to, but it can't be done.

[deity]

Originally posted by CyberShy
Passwords don't work anyway.
If the game continues 1 turn with AI controll, the password of that civ is gone.

Regarding city razing: we should just turn that off.

I think in the powerfull context of the game mechanics city razing is really not on. I detest it myself and won't do it unless an agreed process with another civ.

With passwords, I think it's the only way of entirely eliminating suspicions. Suspicions effects player behaviour and I believe this has happened in several recent games, including HOTW11.

I'm not sure what you mean about getting rid of the password by saving the game but don't explain it please!

As far as my understanding goes all we have to do at session end is save the game; all exit and that's it.... surely?

[LzPrst]

of all the accusations we have had, none of them have been about people sneaking peeks at other peoples civs. and I dont think anyone does that. it's just too dishonest.

[deity]

Originally posted by LzPrst
of all the accusations we have had, none of them have been about people sneaking peeks at other peoples civs. and I dont think anyone does that. it's just too dishonest.

Well, I'm sorry to say that there have been accusations in several games.

However, I agree that it is extremely unlikely anyone has actually done that.

And the only way to get rid of the accusations is to use passwords (and end the session in the correct way) so as to eliminate the issue.

[deity]

So, to get HOTW12 started...

I suggest, once we know the players, that we all log in to the Lobby with our new logins that more or less reflect the name of the leader of the civ we'd like to choose.

So, if I chose Pericles my lobby login (and my Apolyton diplo login perhaps) would be "Pericles xxx" - variations subject to handles already taken.

I'd then pick Pericles/Greece in the Staging Room and then go in to the game. If we have 2 of any choice I'd say don't worry about it.

Thoughts?

[LzPrst]

lots of accusations, but as far as I can recall, it has as far as I can remember never been about people sneek peeking. I am not in favor of passwords, as they should not be necessary.

but it seems we have more or less a consensus over our new rules.

I'm on another unfamiliar laptop, but if someone could summarize the rules outlined so far we could have a final discussion\vote to decide which ones to implement in Hotw12. also, we are getting Apolyton handlers named [Diplo - America] or similar anyway. we should make a '[Diplogame]Country' "clan" on gamespy. or something.

[LzPrst]

b-hump!

[OzzyKP]

No humping my thread.

[deity]

How about a bit more discussions pls

Er, and Happy Bloody Xmas

Fair dinkum and crikey mate...

[LzPrst]

christmas on the beach... deity, you've got it all wrong I tell you.

Looks like I will have to do a rules summary myself. You know how much I hate actually contributing with real work...


For the next Diplogame the following rules, adaptions and changes will be implemented (or discussed ferociously, modified, dropped, remodified, rejected and reinstated in original form).

1. Anonymous playing.
A) Each diploplayer will create a gamespy account called "Diplogame-*name of civ*".
B) Furthermore, every player will do the same with an account here on Apolyton. We have green light from mods to do this, BUT WAIT UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE!!
C) All diplomacy, ALL diplomacy will be done 'IN CHARACTER'.
D) If chatting software is needed, we may decide to create logins following the "Diplogame-*name of civ*, system in a pre-agreed IM client, such as MSN, AIM, YIM, IRC or whatever, as long as we all agree to use the SAME client.
E) Because of the anonymity factor passwords will undoubtedly cause far more problems than they would 'solve'. As such NO ONE, INCLUDING SUBS WHO MUST BE TOLD, NO ONE may password their civs. We are honorable men, and lady, and we do not cheat. We may exploit the system, nudge at the rules, seek to circumvent uncomforts, but we do NOT cheat.


2. Diplomacy Related
A) All alliances must be official and declared in the story thread or in ingame chat if the alliance is created during a session, by BOTH participating Empires.
B) The top 3 Empires on the score chart may NOT be allied with eachother. (the exact timing of the 'forced' break needs discussion)
C) An alliance must have an ingame base consisting of either;
I. Shared Religion
II. Shared Civics (Minimum of same 3 civics)
III. Properly Established story basis. This must have some Established BASE, for example; natural friendship, shared corporations, shared "history, and similar.

- Established meaning Announced before session start in story thread by BOTH players. (ingame announcements may be approved, discussion pending)

D) No Empire can have more than 2 Intricate Diplomatic Connections, making a triple-alliance the largest possible coalition. This includes Established Political Alliances (for whatever approved of in section 2C reason), Defensive Pacts and Vassals. One of the mentioned counts towards your total. In summary, you may have one Vassal and one Defensive Pact, that is your 2 Intricate Diplomatic Connections. Or you may have 2 Allies. A Political Alliance and a Defensive Pact with the same Empire counts as 1 Intricate Diplomatic Connection
(IDC).



3. Tech Trade Restrictions
A) No Tech Brokering option will be checked.
B) You may only trade technology with an Established alliance partner.
C) or the 3 (total player number dependent) lowest scoring players on the score chart.
D) Techs may not be given freely (this needs further discussion)



4. Victory
A) We will again attempt to reintroduce Ozzy's Victory Points System.
B) Changes and Additions must be discussed, among them the possibility of a "vote per session" on the subjective votes and a following balancing of the system, as well as the possibility of creating a website that will add up the scores for us so that we don't need to do it manually.

[deity]

Good work lz

So I take it I'm not allowed to use a password.....



I don't think you were clear enough on this point

[deity]

I can play with those rules as stated by lz but I still think passwords should be used - apparently some layers use them regardless.

And I don't think it's as easy as Cyber suggests in removing them BTW.

[deity]

Originally posted by CyberShy
Passwords don't work anyway.
If the game continues 1 turn with AI controll, the password of that civ is gone.

Regarding city razing: we should just turn that off.

BUT to continue one turn you need ALL human civs present. It's not easy to do.