Vel's Strategy Thread

[Arrian]

For me, the goal is to be able to build peacefully. I can assure that for myself by pulling the teeth of the AI before they have a chance to develop...

"To create, we must destroy. Smash a glass and cry, Too Much Joy!"

The mantra of the buildmonger: I really prefer building, but the AI gets in the way!

As I move up in difficulty, I expect I will become more and more agressive. I fight so that I may build.

-Arrian

[Arrian]

Originally posted by Mountain Sage


you mean, after your neighbours are down to 1 pitiful city each?

I was wondering how long it would take for somebody to come with Arrian's Dark Side Final Solution

Their people are better off under my rule anyway...

-Arrian (who is still pretty peaceful in CIV)

[Golden Bear]

Interesting. I'm only gradually catching up on this thread and have not yet digested the last few pages of posts. I've been playing C4 too much, I guess.

I've concentrated on the Saracens these last several games with an interest in using religion as a tool to victory. BTW, this is on Prince level.

I found out the hard way that the warrior-warrior-worker build queue is a waste of early build hammers because of the idle worker.

My general trend has been warrior-warrior-settler while going for Hinduism and then Agriculture. I skip Buddhism as being far too chancy - you can wind up with neither early religion... and try to place myself in a position to scarf up Judaism if the opportunity presents itself.

The difficulty of this approach is, as has been noted thoroughly already, that terrain improvements come much later because the techs must wait their turn in the queue. Also they take longer because city growth is slammed for a long time by the settler build.

I also tend to crank out tons of early military units for the multiple purposes of protection and exploration.

I am interested in trying to tie this together with the early archer/axe rush.

At lower difficulty level I had tried moderate overexpansion in order shield off an area of territory for myself... try that at Prince and you'll get nailed.

In terms of chopping, I have not really used that and will need to test it. I generally try to develop my first three squares for a settlement to be farm/growth, mine/build and a town. At least at the early part of the game I try to get these towns going and selected so that they will be producing cash as soon as possible to help through the period of expansion/cash crush.

This is probably too balanced an approach for any kind of dramatic early ascendence, so I am interested in these ideas for working the terrain to get a little bit of an early boost. Any tiny advantage at the start can be huge by the end.

GB

[Arrian]

Next up....
The Slave Master's Approach

This I eagerly anticipate. I haven't poprushed yet. I'm curious about its usefulness. I remember the varying degrees of poprush power in CivIII (initially far too strong) and how I eventually came to think of it as a waste of population. Especially given the inability to boost pop via adding workers, I'm dubious about the advantages of sacrificing hard-earned pop points...

Enlighten me as to the glories of slavery and whipping my people to death!

-Arrian

[Rhothaerill]

I'm no expert, but the slavery civic and poprushing have certainly helped me in some instances. I have so far confined the use of it to high food cities, or high-commerce/low-production cities that need a library, etc. (I have a couple of those going in AU100). But it's also nice as I've been tending to run light military in my early games and it almost backfired on me when a horde of barbarians charged me and I had a bit of bad luck attacking them away from the city. A poprushed defender was the only thing standing in the way of losing that city.

It's also useful to the effect that it can be used independently of the other four civics types (government, etc.) In Civ3 if you wanted to be a poprusher you had to stick to specific governments, some that were less than stellar (despotism) or far off (communism). In Civ4, the other labor civics are nice, and I use them too, but there isn't as big of a penalty for sticking to a poprushing civic for a while as there was for sticking to despotism in Civ3.

[DeepO]

Time to jump in here, before the thread evolves in Vel's strat thread II (this is the 500th post).

Great effort, Vel, always nice to hear your thoughts. I haven't been able to catch up, so I wasn't active here, but I'll surely try with the next thread that is undoubtedly going to appear.

Thanks!


DeepO

[vmxa1]

Pop rushing was not my forte in III, but it is very useful for AW games in IV and any time you are going to be beligerent for much of the game (my style often).

In games where you have little in the way of happy tiles or health is an issue, pop some. It is only 10 turns till all is forgiven.

[DrSpike]

Originally posted by Arrian


This I eagerly anticipate. I haven't poprushed yet. I'm curious about its usefulness. I remember the varying degrees of poprush power in CivIII (initially far too strong) and how I eventually came to think of it as a waste of population. Especially given the inability to boost pop via adding workers, I'm dubious about the advantages of sacrificing hard-earned pop points...

Enlighten me as to the glories of slavery and whipping my people to death!

-Arrian

My initial impression is that on the lower levels its really powerful if you get early granaries. As you go higher it seems less so, but still worth a rush every now and then in some cities.

[Mountain Sage]

Originally posted by Arrian

-Arrian (who is still pretty peaceful in CIV)

Don't you worry, it will not last...

[Velociryx]

Looks like we maxed this one out. I've already started summarizing and will have a new one out this weekend, which will include three new essays I've been workin' on...

-=Vel=-

[khearn]

Vel,

We'll be anxiously awaiting the new thread (and especially the new essays).

[Ithkul2]

Strategy - The four city rush:

1. 1st turn settler
2. send scout(warrior) for useable locations (not far away)
3. when settler is done make a new settler
4. when 2nd city is founded make settler
5. when these settlers are done make warrior for defence in all 4 citys.
6. build granary in the 4 cities after warrior is done.

Optional:
7. build lighthouse
8. build worker (one for each city)
9. build library
10. upgrade warrior to axemen
11. build forge (slave rush when you can afford it)

Positive:
* Higher population, production and research later in game compared to others. It will rocket past others on the long term
* Barbarians spawn to late to kill cities

Negative:
* High risk, avoid animals with settlers.
* High risk vs agressive human opponent.
* Very slow tech and development at start.
* Most likely no founding of relgion. Might get islam if you rush it, but i would not recommend it.

- Please let me know your opinion on this topic. thanks

Edit: added slave rush comment

[padillah]

Originally posted by Ithkul2
Strategy - The four city rush:


* Very slow tech and development at start.
* Most likely no founding of relgion. Might get islam if you rush it, but i would not recommend it.

Why would the tech be slower? Do you mean slower than with MORE than 4 cities?

Why would you miss a religion? You didn't mention any tech specific steps so I don't know what your beeline is that makes you avoid religion.

Tom P.

[Bobby Chicken]

it would be slower because you have little commerce in your capitol building all those settlers

[fed1943]

Hi gentlemen:great game and great thread.Trying,as a creative and expansive noble:while the scout explores and grabs some goody huts,the capital maximize food and commerce and begins barracks,and the research path is:mysticism,polytheism,wheel,archery,(a food devlopment acording the city'radius),pottery,mining,bronze working.
Micromanagment of the capital'prodution to build a worker after the weel,go on the barracks,build an archer for city´protection.
Then expansion phase:building military unity(archer first,later axeman)followed by settler,followed by worker;repeat,as possible;(Change production between unity/settler,worker);new cities begin with granary,barracks,then expansion building.
And that's the begining I "discovered"so far.So,please,does some expert say something about?
Best regards,