Does Civ4 required Internet?

[Kuciwalker]

But IMHO any game that requires fast reflects as a designed part of the gameplay is not a true strategy game, although the makers may have designed some strategy elements to the game.

No, it's not "strategy elements". The game is, fundamentally, strategic. It's not fast reflexes, it's fast decision-making. And it's important to note that the strategic aspects of these games are the ones that determine the winners, not the tactical aspects, in general.

[Maquiladora]

If youre downloading the game youre gonna want an internet connection.

[CanuckSoldier]

Sorry Kuciwalker, but I've played AoE, for example, and your differeniating between fast reflects and fast decision making is symantics as far as I'm concerned. Those games are a race, if you are playing AoE in MP, and your connection or computer is a little slower than the competition then you are going to lose.

TBS games even in simutaneous moves mode are inherently based on making the right strategic and tactical decisions. An opponent is not going to sneak up on you if you have a sentry net out. If you have built proper infrastucture you can dynamically respond to an attack. Not to mention you can just get bigger faster and win a domination victory or go for the space race.

TBS games are not a clickfest, they are chess, RTS games may have strategy but only so much as checkers does.

CS

[KyuuA4]

Man, I look forward to playing via US Postal Service.

[CanuckSoldier]

You plan on sending your PBEM saves on floppy disk my snail mail? :-P

CS

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by CanuckSoldier
Sorry Kuciwalker, but I've played AoE, for example, and your differeniating between fast reflects and fast decision making is symantics as far as I'm concerned. Those games are a race, if you are playing AoE in MP, and your connection or computer is a little slower than the competition then you are going to lose.

It's not semantics, it's important. Duck Hunt requires reflexes. Anything more complicated requires tactics and/or strategy, with pure reflext being ancillary. And that lag can make you lose is irrelevent - it's still a strategy game. Fundamentally, the only way to win is to acquire more resources than your opponent.

[Vince278]

Originally posted by Maquiladora
If youre downloading the game youre gonna want an internet connection.

You've got to be kidding me with that avatar.

[Maquiladora]

Kidding you how?

[Vince278]

[DerSchwarzfalke]

I am doubting that Firaxis will be running Civ IV servers a la battle.net?

[Modo44]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker
Not true. You have to respond - strategically - to enemy actions, in addition to tactics.

To which I can only repeat my point about blitz chess. Yes, you need a strategy, but there is no way to develop it during the game. The pace is so fast, you must have strategies prepared beforehand (be that 10 different ones for different situations), or you are dead. I played some MP games in Starcraft, so I know you can prepare strategies (like where to place buildings, what units to build, also in response to what the enemies do). But the fact remains, once the game starts, you only choose a strategy to follow, not develop any.

[Solver]

It's not semantics, it's important. Duck Hunt requires reflexes. Anything more complicated requires tactics and/or strategy, with pure reflext being ancillary. And that lag can make you lose is irrelevent - it's still a strategy game. Fundamentally, the only way to win is to acquire more resources than your opponent.

That is simply wrong. You can often see a player with a weaker economy win, with less resources gathered. The key in AoE, for instance, is to put resources to use quickly and attack relentlessly. And, it does require reflexes - if you're not fast enough at checking building queues, micromanaging units, etc., you will lose even if your strategy is superior.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Modo44
To which I can only repeat my point about blitz chess. Yes, you need a strategy, but there is no way to develop it during the game. The pace is so fast, you must have strategies prepared beforehand (be that 10 different ones for different situations), or you are dead.

That's how most people play civ, or any game. They think about strategies outside the game, and implement them in the game.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Solver

It's not semantics, it's important. Duck Hunt requires reflexes. Anything more complicated requires tactics and/or strategy, with pure reflext being ancillary. And that lag can make you lose is irrelevent - it's still a strategy game. Fundamentally, the only way to win is to acquire more resources than your opponent.

That is simply wrong. You can often see a player with a weaker economy win, with less resources gathered. The key in AoE, for instance, is to put resources to use quickly and attack relentlessly. And, it does require reflexes - if you're not fast enough at checking building queues, micromanaging units, etc., you will lose even if your strategy is superior.

Change that to "acquire and apply" then.

[Solver]

And application of those resources is where speed kicks in. If you have played a reasonable amount of time online, you should know that the deciding factor between two players if often the speed at which one acts. For instance, in Age of Mythology or Age of Kings, players who know the basics but aren't good with them are rated around 1650. Then, the 1750 players know their strats and don't make silly mistakes normally, but the 1850 players are just as good with strats, but move much faster than the 1750 players. This is especially evident if you watch recorded games.