Hammer of the North v2

[hardjoy]

Ooops.... Please note, that the cities.gif and icons.gif files has been missing from the Armada_v1_4.zip file. This demeanor has now been corrected - the zips are now complete.

@jasev, you might want to make sure, you have all the files of the zip on the Spanish website. The correct zip is now 678kb, the flawed one a little over 500kb.

[Shaka Naldur]

hi hardjoy, I'm playing as the danes
it's year 814 and I've done a few conquests,
Cherbourg has been conquered to be a port to patrol the coasts of Ireland, England and Normandy

I also have an expedition in the baltic conquering the barbarian coastal cities. A few cities in Scotland are now Danish territory

I also have conquered all of the Frisian territory to have a stronghold in europe and it is also better to launch an attack from there than from the Jutland Peninsula

having fun hardjoy but I haven´t killed any giant and I don´t have hammer yet, but i don´t know if go and kill just by myself or to use the hammers

[hardjoy]

Sounds like a fun game...

I agree, Frisland is a terrific base to strike almost anywhere in Western Europe. See if you can take the heart of the Rhineland from there - there's a bunch of cities inland with some pretty rich potential.

I know Thor of the mythology used his hammer to slay the giants... but in this game it would probably be to overdo it... -the hammers can probably be put to better use.

I once played a game as the Norse where the Giants would keep coming down from the mountains and attack a particular city - that was a damn nuisance. I'm not sure, but I think *SPOILER* I used an emissary to bribe one of them into the service of the Norse king. Then I used the loyal Giant to beat the rest back to the mountains, once they approached the city

[Leonidas]

I'm currently playing a heavily modified version of "Hellas", and when I'm finished, I will be trying this scenario

[hardjoy]

Please do - looking forward to any comments you might have

[hardjoy]

Hammer of the North v2.8 is ready!

You can find the files here :
http://www.cdgroup.org/forums/tbs/ci...?p=33154#33154

Updates in v2.8 include :

* King regenerating problem has been fixed - now new kings are created only when powerful units draw a 'sword of coronation', buried in sacred stone upon the death of a king - this makes chiefs and thegns, and bribing heirs and heroes the more important. The king regenerations events still need fixes, as some texts only appear once. Otherwise the new 'coronation concept' works very well IMO

* Powerful barbarian warlords now roam Wales, Sweden, the Baltics and Eastern Europe, making life more difficult for the Anglo-Saxons, Germans and Danes. Barbarian warlords are stronger than most units, more spread out and more important/dangerous to counter or bring under influence.

* Pedia complete for improvements and wonders. May still be typos or minor things.

* Some cities have been rearranged for historical accuracy.

* Brand new tiles.dll backdrops makes playing more stylish and provides additional atmosphere to the game.

* Ravens can be built with Pagan Cult, for scouting and protection of armies. Provides an additional element to discoveries and sieges.

* New wonder "Charlemagnes Legacy" in Aachen allows shifting to advanced governments for the civ that holds the city, before the advances have been gained.

Futher fixes and changes are planned for v.2.9 and v.3.0 - please give me your feedback, if you find inconsistencies or have other comments. I am planning to overhaul the king regeneration events once more (with unique kings for each civ), and create a new scenario ending, which closes the scenario off. Still considering switching the frisians for a new viking civ though.

[hardjoy]

It has come to my notice, that CDG is going down in the near future ??? Anybody who knows more? (I've been away from civ2 for a few months).
http://www.cdgroup.org/forums/tbs/ci...opic.php?t=814

I'll arrange for other hosting of the Hammer updates and my other civ2 files (most likely on my own server, crewscut.com). Until then, grab what you can, while you can !!

[Broken_Erika]

new cdg
you'll have to re-register there,
http://www.cdgroup.org/Home/portal.php

[techumseh]

This looks excellent! Thanks.

[techumseh]

Outstanding. I've only played a few turns, but so far it's fun and interesting. Nice graphics, too.

I found AI controlled leader units (Kings, etc.) getting killed in significant numbers already. Is this how you intended it?

I found in playtesting that powerful leader units are far more careful making attacks if you give them the air superiority role instead of the attack role. They still attack, but will usually last for most of the scenario.

[hardjoy]

Thanx, man

I will reconsider a change of roles for kings in the next update, when I evaluate the king units and events. I played around a lot with the roles for the king units. I wanted them to be active forgers of nations, but the AI displayed a tendency to hide them in cities, without the ATT role. But as you say, sometimes they do get killed quickly - but with the new coronation events they will usually be replaced within a short time, when a strong unit 'draws the sword from the stone'...

Of course it also opens a quest for a human player to slay an enemy king, and get in there to draw the sword to gain an additional king, before they do - which can be quite fun.

[techumseh]

I just returned to this scenario while waiting for Santa. Is anyone still playing it? It is one of the best in the last couple of years!

[curtsibling]

I had an awesome time playing it a few months back...

Conquered most of the world for the Pagan hordes!
You really get into the strategy of using raiders and
special units to great a conquering empire...It has
that old CIV2 quality to it...

You win well if you use the unit properly, but not too
easily for the triumphs to feel cheap...Great scenario!

[AGRICOLA]

16 ; # of rows in shield box

I just downloaded the scen from SL and started play when I noticed the above line in RULES. It results in a 50 shield unit or improvement costing 80 shields. Is this intentional or an error?

[curtsibling]

I tend not to mess around with the shield box settings...

I wonder if it could be used to slow the 'too many units' problem in CIV2?

[techumseh]

I think it's intentional, to slow down unit production probably.

[AGRICOLA]

That would seem to be an unusual way of slowing down production. It would make more sense to simply increase the shield cost of units/improvements. Right now the cost in the civilopedia is not the same as the actual cost. That is very confusing to simple-minded players like yours truly.

[techumseh]

Hmmm. Maybe I'll give it a try then.

[AGRICOLA]

While testing some units to make sure that I know how they operate I encountered problems with the three role 6 (Diplomacy) ones: Royal Emissary, Assassin and Bishop.

None of them seem to be able to do anything other than bribe enemy units. None seem to be able to establish embassies, sabotage, investigate cities etc..

I have done the following:
1. Downloaded the scen from SL and extracted all files to DESKTOP/GAME DOWNLOADS/ HAMMER OF THE NORTH v2.9.
2. Started the scen as Norsemen/Deity.
3. Cheated Bishops (Spies) next to a city of each of the other civs.
4. Tried entering the cities.
5. Nothing happened.........no popup of spy options.
6. However, all Bishops could bribe enemy units.
7. Repeated 2 - 6 after giving the Norse all techs, just in case hardjoy had done something innovative with EVENTS.
8. Checked that the Bishop occupies the Spy slot (unit 47).
9. Checked that the list of Spy options is present in the GAME file.

Also:
1. I assume that the SL download is the latest version, or is there a later one?
2. Neither the Royal Emissary nor the Assassin occupies the Diplomat slot. That explains their limited ability.

Could someone please check this out on their version of the scen. It's been driving me absolutely nuts for the last 3 hours.

[techumseh]

@AGRICOLA: All of my diplomatic units operate with full functions, including the Bishop with all spy functions. I'm playing v.2.9, using MGE.

BTW, there is no special ability conferred by the Diplomat slot, only the Spy slot.

[AGRICOLA]

Thank you very much, techumseh. Your positive reply encouraged me to further investigate the problem.

Actually, I have seen something similar in the past with Red Front 1.5 where, in one folder, units could select what they wanted to pillage while, in another folder, there was no option popup.

I managed to figure out that the problem is solely associated with the folder that contains the scen, specifically the folder name, HAMMER OF THE NORTH v2.9.
Evidently, folder names cannot contain a period.
There may be other characters that are also taboo, but I haven't bothered to try to identify them.

Once the period was removed from the folder name, things operated normally.

Thanks again.

[AGRICOLA]

There is at least one problem with using Tech 0 (AFl) as the expiry tech for Papal Reform (Michelangelo's).

In RULES, Mike's is shown to expire with the discovery of Tech 0 (Heresy) but the PEDIA has Expiry: None.
Very misleading to players.
BTW, this is not specific to this scen because the same thing happens in vanilla MGE.

However, as an added feature, in the scen but not in vanilla MGE, there is no effect on happiness when Mike's is built.

Seeing as I seem to be problem prone with Hammer, maybe someone could please check whether this is another of my one-off screwups.

[AGRICOLA]

However, as an added feature, in the scen but not in vanilla MGE, there is no effect on happiness when Mike's is built.

The above is correct but not the whole story.

The crux of the problem is that, in vanilla MGE, Monotheism allows the building of both Cathedrals and the Michelangelo wonder. In Hammer, Theology allows Michelangelo to be built but not Cathedrals. However, Theology is needed to research Architecture, the tech needed to build Cathedrals. Eventually, when Architecture is dicovered, a previously built Michelangelo does take effect.

Obviously, either Architecture should be made a precursor to Theology or Theology should allow the building of both Cathedrals and the Michelangelo wonder.

In other words, one cannot put the cart before the horse: you should be able to build Cathedrals before building Michelangelo.

I finally said to h*** with it and cheated Architecture to the Norse. The neater solution of making Theology the tech needed to build Cathedrals does not seem to work in mid-game.

EDIT: Grammar

[Boco]

Agricola, In ToT, I'm seeing something related to your AFl problem. In EA, AFl was a no, no tech that I was using as a preq for other techs. In the help screen, 'none' was listed as the preq for Alp, which lists AFl as its sole preq. After seeing your post, I gave AFl another tech (CA) as preq, which had no, no as its preqs. Now it works fine. Thanks

[AGRICOLA]

I'm very glad something good came from sorting out the $#@!&?, frustrating, see-for-the-first-time problems in Hammer.

Originally posted by AGRICOLA
In other words, one cannot put the cart before the horse: you should be able to build Cathedrals before building Michelangelo.

I'll bet that this also holds for Pyramids (Granary), Women's Sufferage (Police Station), SETI (Research Lab) and, possibly, Great Wall (City Walls).

[biru biru]

I liked your last viking scenario a lot. This one is even better. Cheers man.

So far I am having the same problem with the diplomats not functioning that Agricola talked about, but no '.' in the folder name. I had a similar problem for a while with my ants scenario though. Anyway, if I figure itout, or if anyone has further to add on this, I'll check back.

[AGRICOLA]

This is one hell of a scenario: original, fun to play and educational. As a consequence, I've spent more than a few interesting hours on the net, reading about the incredible period of Viking expansion. Thanks.

Generally, the scen has been virtually trouble free but, for whaterver they are worth, here are some minor trouble spots, some specific suggestions, and a few comments on gameplay.

1. The names in the wonder expiry list in rules are a bit messed up but everything seems to work fine.
2. Chester should be a coastal city.
3. Should the Great Wall wonder expire during the scen? Artillery to negate walls was not invented till ~1300, after the end of the scen.
4. The sequence of spawning locations for norse kings might be revised so that London is the first choice, Kaupang the second and Nidaros the last one. Despite holding Kaupang, a much more central location, all my kings were spawned in the frozen, miserable, far northern metropolis of Nidaros.
I never had any intention of capturing London. It was the designated 'trading city' for caravans from continental Europe. Similarly, Compiegne was the destination for caravans from Britain, Ireland and Iceland. Enemy cities and ocean voyages make for very profitable trading.
5. Loke, who functions as a one-shot missile, seems grossly overvalued at 800 shields. After capturing Uppsala and getting Loke, to me it was a no-brainer to disband it immediately in order to IRB Michaelangelo's. Decreasing its cost to less than 50 shields would make it much less attractive candidate for disbanding.
6. The name 'tradesmen' (caravan) should be replaced by something like trader. Tradesmen connotes carpenters, plumbers, mechanics etc., at least in North America.
7. Could the city name Abo be changed so that it is spelled with a standard A rather than an accented A .
I encountered problems in the city screen because toggling up through city names skips Abo. Toggling down picks up the city. As I tend to toggle up, I went nearly nuts in trying to find the last unneeded granary in order to sell it.
8. The scen can be played in a variety of ways. I opted for maximum trade to enable bribery in order to capture enemy cities as intact as possible and to avoid having to build libraries, universities, marketplaces and other city improvements. A fleet of 100+ drakkars, cogs and hulks and chaining provided rapid transport of caravans to London and Compiegne. However, a problem arose whenever a caravan or freight had to move along roads or cross-country. The mega-map is so large that moving 1 or 2 squares per turn is boringly, and unrealistically, slow. I would suggest either doubling the movement rate or, at least, increasing the road multiplier from 2 to 3.
9. I tried some minor changes to the map to model the Arctic Ocean, Black Sea and the navigable part of the Danube River, all of which were sailed by the Vikings. For the Arctic Ocean, the north end of the Baltic was closed off and a line of ocean squares put in across the top of the map. The Black Sea was modelled by a line of ocean squares along the bottom of the map between the Danube and the Dnieper. The Danube was made navigable from the Black Sea to just north of Regensburg, approximately where the present-day Main-Danube Canal joins the Danube. The changes seemed to work well and made exploration and trade a bit easier and, possibly, more realistic.
10. From previous posts, I had the impression that discovering Baptism was the kiss of death for the Norse. Wrong. As long as some Norse cities are building ravens when Baptism is discovered, there is no particular problem.

Inscription on a rune stone near Reykjavik:
Blessed are heroes and giants for they are the true king makers.

Great scen!
I really enjoyed it.