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Aginor,
Well, I moved on to the next civ I haven't tried yet, the British, and got rushed very early by the Germans while I was trying to rush the other British civ. (Seems you can have more than one copy of a civ when asking for random opponents.) The German rush worked and my own didn't!
This was a new experience for me, being rushed that early in a game, since in previous games the first AI that came calling usually did so after researching Classical, themselves. My curiosity was piqued, so just to see what would happen, I replayed from the same start a few times, and each time the Germans rushed me very early, no matter how I varied my opening.
I am beginning to think that much depends on the neighboring civs you are up against, and your initial starting position relative to them. (I always use the random settings in my games for opponents and maps). After watching a few early replays in Toughest, I have noticed that most AI civs start off booming until they have two cities with a market and university. These are the only AI civs I dare rush myself.
However, "aggressive" civs such as the Romans (and Germans) build a barracks early and will rush a neighbor afterwards. This neighbor isn't always necessarily the human player.
Anyways, in my successful games I recollect facing early boomers more instead of early rushers, which may help explain the difference in aggressiveness we are noticing so far in our Toughest 4-player games.
As for delaying Classical and Gunpowder, I did not mean to imply that doing this prevents AI attacks, only that it seems to delay them somewhat. The AI will still attack early, and I usually end up going Classical and learning attrition as soon as the first attack is in progress. Could be that more games with the more passive civs may have misled me here. (Also I think I meant to say by 3 minutes instead of 5 when trailing the AI into Classical in my previous post).
Another hunch I have is that the AI are more likely to attack when you start building a wonder, although there is a delay before the attack materializes. I am fairly sure that any kind of early provocation, even a slight border push with a new city or fort, invites earlier retaliation.
Map types may also be a factor in the timing of AI rushes, too. They may be more prevalent on certain kinds of maps. It will take many more games and a lot of experimentation to sort these things out, and see how different factors or actions affect AI behavior.
When I rush early, I research Military second after Science and build a barracks first, as close to the target as possible. Then I send a slinger followed by 4 hoplites. If the target has not built a tower or barracks, and I can keep preventing this with my patrolling slinger, 4 hoplites almost always prevail. To play it safer I may follow up with an archer or two. I always target the capital and I've replayed several openings with different civs and this kind of rush has worked better than I would have thought it would in these various experiments.
BTW, nice going on your successful game! Any kind of 4-player survival win on Toughest is well deserved, I think. There's hardly any margin for error, even if you are up against the "passive" civs.
Grond,
I agree about timber and how the Colossus helps provide more of it when it's needed the most. I think timber is the hardest resource to manage, since I'm always wishing I had more of it.
Well, I moved on to the next civ I haven't tried yet, the British, and got rushed very early by the Germans while I was trying to rush the other British civ. (Seems you can have more than one copy of a civ when asking for random opponents.) The German rush worked and my own didn't!
This was a new experience for me, being rushed that early in a game, since in previous games the first AI that came calling usually did so after researching Classical, themselves. My curiosity was piqued, so just to see what would happen, I replayed from the same start a few times, and each time the Germans rushed me very early, no matter how I varied my opening.
I am beginning to think that much depends on the neighboring civs you are up against, and your initial starting position relative to them. (I always use the random settings in my games for opponents and maps). After watching a few early replays in Toughest, I have noticed that most AI civs start off booming until they have two cities with a market and university. These are the only AI civs I dare rush myself.
However, "aggressive" civs such as the Romans (and Germans) build a barracks early and will rush a neighbor afterwards. This neighbor isn't always necessarily the human player.
Anyways, in my successful games I recollect facing early boomers more instead of early rushers, which may help explain the difference in aggressiveness we are noticing so far in our Toughest 4-player games.
As for delaying Classical and Gunpowder, I did not mean to imply that doing this prevents AI attacks, only that it seems to delay them somewhat. The AI will still attack early, and I usually end up going Classical and learning attrition as soon as the first attack is in progress. Could be that more games with the more passive civs may have misled me here. (Also I think I meant to say by 3 minutes instead of 5 when trailing the AI into Classical in my previous post).
Another hunch I have is that the AI are more likely to attack when you start building a wonder, although there is a delay before the attack materializes. I am fairly sure that any kind of early provocation, even a slight border push with a new city or fort, invites earlier retaliation.
Map types may also be a factor in the timing of AI rushes, too. They may be more prevalent on certain kinds of maps. It will take many more games and a lot of experimentation to sort these things out, and see how different factors or actions affect AI behavior.
When I rush early, I research Military second after Science and build a barracks first, as close to the target as possible. Then I send a slinger followed by 4 hoplites. If the target has not built a tower or barracks, and I can keep preventing this with my patrolling slinger, 4 hoplites almost always prevail. To play it safer I may follow up with an archer or two. I always target the capital and I've replayed several openings with different civs and this kind of rush has worked better than I would have thought it would in these various experiments.
BTW, nice going on your successful game! Any kind of 4-player survival win on Toughest is well deserved, I think. There's hardly any margin for error, even if you are up against the "passive" civs.
Grond,
I agree about timber and how the Colossus helps provide more of it when it's needed the most. I think timber is the hardest resource to manage, since I'm always wishing I had more of it.
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