TBS Alternatives

[moomin]

The planet-stealing stuff utterly ruins what would otherwise be a solid contender in the 4x space genre. They got so much right - combined arms are a necessity, planetary defenses are worth something, research is split into theory and practice, with interesting trade-offs to be had every now and then, starlanes give raise to rally interesting "terrain" strategies... and then it's all for nothing, because the end-game is an ever-flipping game of planetary allegiance.

Disgusting.

[Sikander]

I have to say that SMAC / X is a must see game. It's really interesting from a player standpoint, and all around a high quality effort. You can get SMAC for less than 10$ U.S. mail order, while the (very good) expansion SMACX is harder to find.

[Ozymandous]

Originally posted by RolandtheMad
I highly recommend SMAC & SMACX (The expansion). Alpha Centauri is a really, really good game. Like someone else said, the story is good (you can turn it off when youre tired of it too), the factions have real depth, diplomacy is good.. all around good game. Don`t know what else to say.

SMAC? Dull and boring. Some like it and indeed it did have very good diplomacy model, but the AI was horrible and all you had to do was plant forests everywhere to win (IMHO, but I only played it to conclusion a handful of times, too much red/green.)

Another game I recommend is Call to Power 2. Alot of people don`t like this game, but it is pretty good after you put some mods on it - all available here at Apolyton.

As with SMAC the AI in this game is horrible, only good if you mod it heavily with user created stuff (which is sad to have to do!)

You could try Civ 2 ToT (Test of Time). It is an o.k. game I guess. Doesn`t have build queues though. I couldn`t stand that.

Civ2 is decent but *very* dated. Civ 3 has a lot more and better features than this, although if you want multiplayer Civ3 is _not_ the way to go.

As for Civ 3 - I`ve only heard bad things about it. I considered buying it when it came out but I`m glad I didn`t.

Civ3 is a good, deep strategy game. Most who complain (that's 95% of the people here at Apoly who played Civ2 and couldn't.wouldn't change their play style) haven't played it with the newest patch and/or refuse to adapt their play to the game, preferring the game to be SOSDD to fit with their methods (heh).

(BTW, why comment on a game at all if you never played it? Just don't recommend it but you don't need to bash it.)

Finally, consider a game called Stronghold. It isn`t TBS, but it is a true medival strategy game. If you`ve ever wanted to play a really, really good castle building game this is it. There are two campaigns (Military and Economy) and a free build mode.

Sorry, Stronghold is NOT a castle building game!!! If you want a castle BUILDING game, get an old game called "Castles" where you have to actually plan the layout of the castle then defend the area while the castle is actually being built, unlike Stronghold, where as soon as you lay the walls out, *poof* they are 100% complete.

So, I say get SMAC. The others are kind of iffy. If you`ve already got SMAC I`d go CTP2 if you want a civ type game or Imperium Galactica 2 if you want a space game.

Yeah, get SMAC if you want all red/green graphics and horrible AI. I'd try Civ3 with the newest patch, but then again this is only mu opinion.

[RolandtheMad]

Blah..! Why do you so loathe SMAC? Maybe it is because you 'refuse to adapt your play to the game'. I found it to be fun an challenging while trying to achieve the goals of my faction.. except for the Hive which was really easy to swarm the world on most difficulties. If you really don`t like the graphics there is an alternate art set with yellow fungus I think.

You should try to not build forests and instead build fungus and go for a transcendant win as the Gaians or Planet Cult.

Or perhaps you could try to unite the various factions and follow the dream of peace and democracy under Brother Lal and the Peacekeepers.

Finally, yes, the AI is easy to beat on most difficulties if you`re strictly a war monger which is what I suspect you are. If you want really challenging AI that can stand up to human intellect I think you`d be hard pressed to find it unless it was a cheating AI with loads of advantages.

As to Civ 3, I only included that because I`ve heard so many bad things about it. Just a warning I suppose.

[vmxa1]

Ozymandous, I would tend to agree with your assesment, except to say SMAC was an excellent game.
The red/green was hard to take and the game was too easy ala civ2. Both were too easy, but were lot of fun. I did finally get burned out on SMAC and I would say Civ3 is much superior to Civ2. At the higer levels it can give you a decent game and I have PTW and all the patches.

[Destroyer]

STARS! - This game is the worst looking game Ive ever seen in my life. A ZX makes this look ****e. Yet there is a simple but fantastic game laying hidden underneath. It reminds me of the first time I played civ.

Wha it really needs is a civ2/3 style upgrade in terms of depth (it has no diplomacy) and graphics (the planets look quite nice). And the combat could have a moo2 graphical style - keeping the "guts", of the combat model.

The scope is the biggest 4x game ever. And has the best weapons too. What othergame allows you to fling asteroids across deep space. You can commit interplanetary genocide without even getting out of bed (so to speak).

[vmxa1]

They are sitting on the sequel now for a vey long time.

[Destroyer]

Is that Reach for the Stars?

I heard they could not find a publisher for it. I think it would struggle to sell well unless it had a huge visual revamp (and I do mean huge). But they could look to sell it online to the "hardcore", even if it is a beta.

[vmxa1]

No I was talking about Stars! Supernova. The longer it tkes the less it will be worth. Graphics that were created 2 or 3 years ago have gotten stale.
BTW the further I read the strat guide for Moo3 the more I see Space Empire ideas in it.

[vee4473]

How about Age of Mythology2? Slighty different gameplay to get used to, but if you like fantasy stuff, it's a cool game.

I like the combat.

[Destroyer]

Originally posted by vee4473
How about Age of Mythology2? Slighty different gameplay to get used to, but if you like fantasy stuff, it's a cool game.

We is talking (real) strategy!

Never played Space Empires VMXA. Whats the low-down?

Im sure it was you taht recommended STARS! to me, so your opinion is held in high regard

[vee4473]

well, AOE2 has as much strategy involved as any other TBS game..

Mastering the elements of a fantasy world is very difficult, but that could be difficult to anyone whio is used to units that are more "realistic"

after all, to someone who is used to civ, the differences of a cat warrior to a priest may not be understandable.

that's why i said "if you like fantasy"...

i still am getting to understand the units,


but the thread is about TBS games, so AOE2 is a good game to recommend if you like fantasy...need i say it again...if you like fantasy!!


And to say that there is no "real" strategy because it is a fantasy setting is pure...well....stupidity

[vee4473]

i meant AOM2 where AOE2 is mentioned

[Destroyer]

Looked at the official website for supernova, and I have to say Im actually more impressed with the graphics and gameplay than I am with a lot of MOO3s.

It does not look as if it going to get a release though. The site has not been updated for a while.

[Destroyer]

Isnt AOM a RTS?