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  • The attacker goes first or real init is a selectable option.
    what do you think about the point I was making on 1.2 being so much easier than 131?

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    • Originally posted by vmxa1
      I can't speak to feudal on 1.2 as that was too long ago, but on 1.31 feudal is a real pain. You have to go to all out war mode to offset the research.
      I had remembered it being quite difficult also, especially since I have very limited experience with it. This time a few things worked to my benefit. My first leader was Lydon, who kind of sucks, except when you get him really early. Then his megawealth, fame and diplomacy really help. I was able to get up and out with outpost ships to meet and greet, and then got into research and trade agreements with three alien races (The Cats, The Dogs and the Trilarians).

      My research was pathetic, but I got a ship leader early on who added 15 rp, which was about a 50%+ gain at that point. I cranked colonies out as fast as possible and dropped them on the worlds previously staked out by my outpost ships. Then I put auto-factories, hydroponic farms, research labs and missle bases up.

      I had never used scout labs before, but my enormous command point surplus and pitiful research point total combined to make me take a look at them. It seemed a good move for another reason, as it might keep the AI from getting acquisitive as well. It worked like a charm, though of course the tiny benefits realized by the scout labs only had an impact on my research rate for a short time.

      The funny thing was that no one messed with me for quite a while. I guess because I played a repulsive race so much in the past I was used to getting slammed if I had such a slow start. Finally the Klackons got mad at me (I was framed, probably by the Darloks) and declared war. I was shocked at how easily that went. My fleet just walked over them, and they were assimilated. Their workers are better than mine, so I'm having a ball.

      Next game we'll try 1.31

      Btw, can anyone describe for me how the initiative system works? One of the huge advantages in 1.2 is that I always seems to go first in tactical combat. Early on I use this time well, and by midgame a combat rarely lasts beyond the middle of my initial fire phase. It would be nice to see things mixed up a bit.
      He's got the Midas touch.
      But he touched it too much!
      Hey Goldmember, Hey Goldmember!

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      • Tactical combat ship initiative is now an option on the Game/Settings
        screen. When this option is enabled, ships in combat will move in
        the order of their initiative rating. The initiative rating is equal
        to the ship's total beam offense bonus divided by 10 plus the ship's
        current combat speed [Offense/(10+speed)]. Thus, smaller ships should
        move before bigger, slower ones.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Zealot
          Unification(6) + Tolerant(10) + +1 Industry(3) + Large HW(1)
          Repulsive(-6) + -1 Ground Combat(-2) + -1 Ship Defense(-2)

          Easiest race in the game, since you can't have more production than this! More prod means more colony bases and c. ships, so you have more pop, and therefor more science.

          Sweet, sweet race!
          I stumble across a note I had made about playing this race and remembered your post. This is one of the 2 strongest races (or easiest games) I recall playing. I just fired it up again, just rolling along. Too good of a start with 3 planets besides my HW, not even fair. Prewarp, 8 players, impossible, did not notice what the size is or the age. Tol is the one trait, that I would use Uni with in single player game. Now you do not need to build anti pollution or morale enhancers as long as you do not add in any slaves. I got Houri and used her as I had one world with natives, so they polluted.
          This will be a quick game.

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          • If this is one of the 2 strongest...

            Which is the other strongest then vmxa1?

            I'm having my most success with this one though I admit I haven't tried too many variations since I found it:

            low G penalty
            spying penalty
            ground combat penalty

            creative
            subterranean
            aquatic
            large home world

            The huge pop bonus makes all the difference.
            Last edited by xoham; October 27, 2002, 18:43.

            Comment


            • I played a race that was Democartic/Lith/LHW/RHW and it was a power house. Two others that are very strong are Dem/Creative/Aqua and Tele/Lith/AHW/LHW.
              Really there are a ton of very good races, some play better with specific set ups. If Creative, the larger the world the better and advance tech is better than prewarp. Lith types do better in a mineral rich universe. Tele is best in a not so huge universe, so they can get on their neighbors quickly. Home World values are more important to a tele, as they need to get moving fast. The longer they wait the better the defense will be on those planets. You can often replace AHW with a +sci in a bigger universe to better use, if the game goes on for awhile +sci is used on more planets. It helps the aqua creative race as they have more population and creative wants that research boost. These are just my opinons.

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              • What penalties do you choose for these? I find that if I have a spying penalty and no Creative, its tough to get the techs I really want. With Creative, you can eventually get enough spying techs to steal stuff (or at least produce decent spy defense).

                Hard to compromise between armor and fuel cells. I think the game conspires to surround me with empty systems on Impossible. I cant very well be taking on monsters/Orion without some decent armor, and I can't reach enemy systems til midgame without some fuel cells.

                Maybe trade for techs?

                Maybe I will switch to ship defense as the penalty.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by xoham
                  What penalties do you choose for these? I find that if I have a spying penalty and no Creative, its tough to get the techs I really want. With Creative, you can eventually get enough spying techs to steal stuff (or at least produce decent spy defense).

                  Hard to compromise between armor and fuel cells. I think the game conspires to surround me with empty systems on Impossible. I cant very well be taking on monsters/Orion without some decent armor, and I can't reach enemy systems til midgame without some fuel cells.

                  Maybe trade for techs?

                  Maybe I will switch to ship defense as the penalty.
                  Depends. Current choices are Rep, -Ship Def, -Ground combat. If you want to spy then -spy is painful until you get all the tech to boost it up. In a huge uni you may have time to do that as a creative race. Sometimes I play with + to spying and just go for stealing as I do in Moo1.
                  You can skip the earliest cell if you use outpost to get out farther.
                  You can often skip the first armor and wait for Z-armor, that is all you need for a long time and by the time you are doing the 1500 rp you should be able to steal some things. The real killer for me is not having missible bases.

                  Comment


                  • Hm. Perhaps we should have a tread over the most difficult tech choices? You need automated factories, but being w/out missile bases is difficult. For me, the "worst" choices are in the comp ladder - it's always comp vs. science building, and I so need them both. They are difficult to trade as well.
                    "The number of political murders was a little under one million (800,000 - 900,000)." - chegitz guevara on the history of the USSR.
                    "I think the real figures probably are about a million or less." - David Irving on the number of Holocaust victims.

                    Comment


                    • Yes, there are several nasty choices. I have suffered many times for the lack of computers on beam ships.

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                      • I only skip Trit if I'm playing in a huge galaxy with 4 players (me + 3 others). Otherwise, ALWAYS get tritanium armor.

                        Missile bases are useless unless you have mercs with zortium armor and your opponents Batleships don't have a good computer.
                        "BANANA POWAAAAH!!! (exclamation Zopperoni style)" - Mercator, in the OT 'What fruit are you?' thread
                        Join the Civ2 Democratic Game! We have a banana option in every poll just for you to vote for!
                        Many thanks to Zealot for wasting his time on the jobs section at Gamasutra - MarkG in the article SMAC2 IN FULL 3D? http://apolyton.net/misc/
                        Always thought settlers looked like Viking helmets. Took me a while to spot they were supposed to be wagons. - The pirate about Settlers in Civ 1

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Zealot
                          I only skip Trit if I'm playing in a huge galaxy with 4 players (me + 3 others). Otherwise, ALWAYS get tritanium armor.

                          Missile bases are useless unless you have mercs with zortium armor and your opponents Batleships don't have a good computer.
                          Most things are situational. With 8 players, I have seen ships show up and the fight is a toss up with just a star base. If I had a missile base at that point it would be a chinch. I have not played with less than 8 players in a long time so I can not address that. I would normally take the armor and skip the cells as outpost can be use to extend my range. again it is all situational. Some conditions, I do X, other times, I do Y.

                          Comment


                          • My favorite custom race:

                            Creative
                            Democratic
                            +1 production
                            large homeworld
                            All combat and spying negatives.

                            When I get my evolutionary mutation, I add "Warlord"

                            I don't play MOO2 often anymore, but occasionally I like a romp on "hard" which of course, isn't. That's kinda the point for me.

                            -Arrian
                            grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

                            The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

                            Comment


                            • Yes that is a good choice. I had at times picked warlords at that stage if I needed more command points. If the darloks are still around, Omni is good so they can not use stealth to sneak up. Good to see you play Moo/Moo2.

                              Comment


                              • A technomancer race for 1.31 :-)

                                Creative
                                Aquatic
                                Large home world
                                Artifacts home world
                                +1 Research

                                Penalties:
                                Low gravity world
                                -20 Ship attack
                                -10 Espionage

                                I have NEVER lost a "no save/load" game on impossible /huge or large galaxy/ max number of opponents with this one .... As someone said - too easy :-)

                                There may be similar race with Democracy; but it should give up aquatic and +1 Research, and may be take other penalties. I like the described one more because it has the same amount of research and better production and spy defense.

                                For better challenge you can try "no save/load" game on impossible with 340% difficulty - Huge galaxy; Start tech level - Advanced.

                                BTW my hi score is 26000+ and is without capturing pop cheat :-) Here is another hint for gaining better population count -> destroy the bad planets with stellar converters and build up them again. They will return as Large planets that can be terraformed :-)

                                Another thing that is not known to everyone:
                                There are 8 antarian techs (that kan not be researched by normal means). Capturing Orion gives you 4 of them. To get all you have to capture antarian ships first (not too easy, damn quantum detonators!) and scrap them at your colonies. This way you can obtain 4 technologies
                                (xentronium, particle, damper field, quantum detonator) even from the smallest ships and then capure Orion for the rest 4 (spatial compressor, black hole, death ray, reflection field).

                                You can get Moleculartronic Comp & Neutronium bomb from the antarains too (best comp & best bomb) :-)
                                Against stupidity the very gods themselves contend in vain.

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