Society VII: Resurrection

[Theben]

Originally posted by DarkCloud
Wait... are you saying that the number of cities captured should be captured AFTER casualties are applied?

Yes, but only in the event of 2-way battles. One way battles don't change.

[Theben]

Originally posted by DarkCloud
Theben's cash bonuses really helped.
Jonny could have given him a run for his money if he hadn't gotten ganked.

I was actually more concerned about Spaced until Jonny overran EPW. Having him get pounded by 2 civs and still coming out strong shows just how powerful his initial position was.

As for strategy guides, I can list what MJW did wrong on a few occasions:

Mentioning foreign aid as a means of saving Sparrow. If he looks back and thinks about it, at the time no one else was in a position to aid Sparrow except me.

Constant trading with a single empire can be indicative of an alliance, which is what I perceived (correctly, I think) wrt Jonny and MJW. Sparrow and I had multiple conversations about this and talked to Spaced about it once or twice.

If they were allied, the biggest mistake was not dual targeting Spaced army construction, since at the time he had no armies. Whether or not he could've built more cities probably would not have saved him as between the two they could've carved up his empire, leaving me and Sparrow in an inferior position vs. MJW and Jonny.

As for generic strategy:
Don't start a war unless you can reach your goals within 2-3 turns. Prolonged conflict is a nation-killer.

When spying, don't always pick the obvious target. Armies is good, but trade has long lasting game effects, and cities will slow expansion and hurt their economy. If you really want a specific wonder, think about targeting that phase.

Lastly, don't get caught w/o an army.

[Spaced Cowboy]

I think spies should be more under the radar and not cause an automatic declaration of war. The text should say Theben's army production was sabotaged, not who did it unless they were cause by Theben's spy. This is more real world since spies are only known when they get caught.

Congrats Theben. I was stuck on trying to stop you from building wonders. Would have helped had I been able to spy secretly.

I like that we nerfed trading income a bit, but I still think it needs to be nerfed more. I would make the game play out a little longer.

I tried weakly to ally with Jonny, but he seemed to more interested in rolling over me.

War seems to be a hard road to climb in this game. Especially an early war.

Maybe we need to add tactics to war; Rock paper scissors style

attack beats flank
flank beats defend
defend beats attack

A win gives you 2x army strength?

Probably too much to add to an already complicated game.

[MJW]

Spaced could have stopped the wonder win by building a building a wonder and locking out the 7-wonder win.

[Theben]

Yes, my main concern was Spaced placing a huge bid on a single wonder.

As for spies and auto DoW, that's supposed to be only if caught. If the player doesn't want to go to war he can always announce it.

[DarkCloud]

Theben, re the two-ways battles thing- that does make sense. I think I will change that.

Theben, re the spies... I was figuring that if the societies were at war that as GM I could state where the sabotage came from? Do you think that should be prohib. too and only spies caught are IDed as being culpable?

[Theben]

My position is that only caught spies are IDed. If two nations are at war, the other players can infer for themselves where the spies came from, right or wrong.

[Theben]

And to a rock/paper/scissors 'tactics' addition. I figure if people want to go to war, plan ahead!

[MJW]

War might be to tough to do... Maybe something should be added...I'm not good enough to know. I think a 2x rock-paper-sissors game would do nothing but add luck and more imbalances in a pretty imbalanced game.

[MJW]

Originally posted by Theben
Yes, my main concern was Spaced placing a huge bid on a single wonder.

As for spies and auto DoW, that's supposed to be only if caught. If the player doesn't want to go to war he can always announce it.

Then maybe you should have stopped his wonder-building phrase . Unless you where allies or something.

[Spaced Cowboy]

Yes sabotaging his wondering build phase did cross my mind, but then having DC announce that I did it at end turn would not help me as Sparrow and Theben would then gang up on me on the next turn....but if I could have done it without anyone knowing who it was, my chances of deception would have been better.

I disagree with changing the army formula in the attack versus attack since for example in my battle with MJW, if he was not attacking me the calculations would have been the same for the amount of cities taken. (Since the same formula was used). If you are going to apply casualties before captured cities, you need to be consistent and do it in other (attacker versus defender) battles.

[Theben]

I was going to defend my wonder build phase, but then it occurred to me that if my trade got sabotaged I wouldn't be able to afford them anyway, so I defended that.
The flip side of not knowing who spied you is that you get to accuse anyone.

I see you argument wrt battles, but in that case I feel 1 ways need to be changed also.

Another random thought: Spies stealing tech? Yay or nay?

[DarkCloud]

Hm. I don't see anything wrong with spies stealing tech- as long as it's only one tech level at a time.

[Theben]

What phase would defend against it? Research?

Are we doing a new game?

[DarkCloud]

I think we will... I'll start up a new thread and we'll get the rules hammered out there. I think a good goal to set is starting the actual game sometime around September 15-20th?