[DESIGN/GRAPHICS] Natural disasters

[SMIFFGIG]

Natural disasters are common place throughout history

weather or not they are small scale to large scale. This is something currently lacking from CTP2, yet it has and does play a huge part in the history of the world. I think this is something that should certainly be implemented into CTP2

Some disasters could simply be (smaller scale) and appear as message boxes/warning boxes (if it happened near by and effected surrounding wildlife and land but not your civilization/city directly

To the other extreme of visible changes in terrain (errupting volcanos and asteroids... yes a very real threat read here for more info

http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/space/spacechat/livechat/duncan_steel.shtml

I would really love this idea and im sure others would, but OF COURSE it would need alot of discussion (reason for this thread) and alot of work (graphics and balancing) but when worked right i really think this would be great

Effecting terrain and the landscape over time would be a nice feature of the disasters also (and even a nice feature in general without having to involve disasters)

-SMIFFGIG

[Ekmek]

Could we make these barbarian units that are destroyed after attacking or after one turn? But also cant' be attaced. I figure we can do more with CtP2 now than Civ3 editing

Great Ideas by the way (I assume though people would want these as options)

[Maquiladora]

The thing about random events is that they can become annoying as hell if the player doesnt feel he can control or affect them some how, or at least i do. Disease related disasters are fine if you can prevent them with buildings, but if you just got so far ahead then an earthquake comes along and kills 10 pop from your capitol its annoying, not fun.

[tyrantpimp]

Yeah i agree with you maq but it should be something that could be turned off and on like pollution. Then again pollution can be coped with i suppose thats why they made underwater cities possible. Anyway the point is toggle switches good forced play options bad.

have a banana?

[Gilgamensch]

I am not sure , but defently as an option.

And how do you want to prevent the damage from vulcanos with buildings Same goes for a Tsunami.

Ok, plagues might be able to be prevented with buildings (pest = hospitals, but would come already fairly late).
Femine (sp?) could be prevented with granary.

But I see one big drawback: It might be to anoying for players. Let's imagine you are already struggling to keep up with you enemies/opponents and suddenly you are being struck with disasters. That could be a fun-killer

If we would make it that the leading player(s) would be struck more likely, that could make a difference:

Explanation, why: As they would do more research, a desease would be more likely. Trying to invent better weapons, could cause huges fires in a city. Or like upsetting their gods for not fullfilling their wishes

Generally speaking: (my point of view)

It might be an interresting option for 1 or 2 games, but I guess people will then switch it off.

[Maquiladora]

And how do you want to prevent the damage from vulcanos with buildings Same goes for a Tsunami.

Thats why i said disease related disasters.

Punishing the leading player in science with an earthquake is just silly and totally unfair. A better thing would be to give drastic pollution increases for the first person to discover a particularly polluting advance, then the next players to discover it get less pollution each time.

So player 1 discovers Industrial Revolution first, he gets the massive increase in pollution from pop and production, then player 2 discovers it next and gets half as much pollution, player 3 a quarter of it etc.

[Gilgamensch]

Maq,

Just wanted to say it in my words and I thought maybe yours was a bit short, just wanted to give more details, nothing else

And no, I didn't mean to say, the leader shall be punished by earthquake, more thinking in the direction of disease myself as mentioned in the examples.

For the pollution:

not sure about. There were countries being the first to invent something and they never used it in such a way which we think nowadays of and therefore not really causing the pollution:

Explosives: Chinese, only used for fireworks till Europeans came over and stole it.
Oil Refinery: Not sure, who invented it, but Oil has been used for quite a while and only when used for 'industrial-scale' purpose it was becoming a problem.
Industries: Same thing, it was just a question of the scale, not the first one inventing it.
Automobile: Invented by Mercedes and Benz, wasn't really any problem at this time, only like ~30 years later it started, when it was getting onto a great scale.

So, then only the player, which reached a certain number of facilities shall be 'punished', but not the one inventing it.

Another nice example: Atomic Energy: I don't think whoever developed it first, knew about the possible problems and pollution out of it.

[Maquiladora]

The same can be said for punishing the leader with diseases, if diseases are included then it should be a fair spread, except if the leader has 2x the population of the 2nd place player. However it would still be an annoying feature to me.

The thing about the tech tree is that however many branches there are, there is still a clear leader. Like there isnt one leader in military branch and another in governments, it just doesnt pay enough to go one way. Thats mostly due to the clear ladder system of governments, where it gives too much benefit for reaching the next gov.

[Gilgamensch]

I think I would try it once or twice and back to normal.

But that's just my opinion. I know form other's that they hardly ever use random events as they can be to unbalancing.

[The Big Mc]

Don’t panic about un eropted volcanos , eroping volcanos and impact sites the graphics are alredy done and siting on my hard disk

[SMIFFGIG]

ok remember, these random events dont have to be dramatic. They can be simple things like halfed production for 1 turn
or halfed food income in neighboring cities for 2 turns etc etc

Not only this they will be random (alot of CTP2 and any civ game is random and about luck as it is) if you seen your greatest apponent loose a fleet at see due to heavy stormy climate in that area
Or watched a better opponent (more technologically advanced than you) have a nuclear bomb test go wrong and have riots in some cities.
Just think how satisfying it will be, it would open up a whole new door in strategies.

More so, looking now i named this thread incorrectly, as its not just disasters, this will also be random events in YOUR benefit
Say serveyors have recently found a new source of high quality gold next to city "x" (or due to recent geological activity) watever take your pick

These things happen in real life and have done through the years, they would also add SO! much to gameplay its untrue (and realism may i add)
I think its just something to be to be ignored (another aspect in which CTP2 can be made far superior to other Civ games)

This can be made balanced, and can be made so its not just an annoyance (of course its gunna be annoying if a city is hit by a large earthquake and you lose 1 population)
then again its gunna be good when you stumble upon that newly found diamond deposit or watch a close by enemy loose a farm tile improvement due to hurricane winds.

Well what else can i say for now

-SMIFFGIG

[The Big Mc]

yes sounds good could be an idea to have them on a slide bar

bad to good

none to loads

[child of Thor]

Yes i think its the scale of impact that people are worrying about, not so much that they could be in the game.
I dont mind them at all(i like Cradle for having them), i find they add a small amount of atmosphere to the game(i'm talking about other games that have used them as well). A sliding scale on the world creation screen sounds cool if it could be done

If they are done in the proper balanced way they can enhance a game, a bit like having a cut-scene or wonder movie......

[Lou Wigman]

Caution is needed here. If the disaster is bad enough or happens at a bad time then this is just a case of reaching for the re-load button. In CRADLE the disease thing was so frequent that in the end it annoyed the hell out of me and I simply refused to accept it. RELOAD yet again.

If you are going to have bad things happen then this must be offset by some good things as well. For example, if a volcano goes off nearby and destroys this that and the the other a new resource/trade good or whatever could appear to ease the pain.

This is not really as un-realistic as it may sound. Take a look at Indonesia. The volcanic soils in Java are so rich that they can support three crops per year.

[The Big Mc]

When I tried to implement the volcano via slic I made it so a volcano was surrounded by a super grass land which was rich in production, food and comers simulating reality. What we would have to do however is to pre setup the eruption dates so that the reload does not work and the disaster happens anyway.