Israeli Police Beat 15 year old American Citizen

[rah]

If Israel wants Palestinians to fire rockets from unpopulated areas, they're more than welcome to give them back some land.

Or they could just fire them from their member's homes and meeting places.

[My Wife Hates CIV]

or they could just stop... all have a drink and be friends.

[rah]

If religion wasn't involved they probably would.

[My Wife Hates CIV]

and whats sad is all this 'religion' is complete fluff.

[rah]

Born out of fear of death and used as an excuse to send more to it. *sigh*

[Dinner]

It doesn't make it a legitimate target.

You can keep repeating that if you want but both the Geneve and Hague conventions say you are wrong. Protected sites lose all protection if used as a military location. According to both conventions it is a war crime and the blame falls solely upon the offending party who used a protected site for military purposes. Naturally the usual Jew hating, Arab clock sucking, two faced bigots ignore that clause because it doesn't fit their narrative of hating Jews.

[C0ckney]

keeping up your record nicely there i see oredin.

[C0ckney]

the blame falls solely upon the offending party who used a protected site for military purposes.

and certainly not on the israelis, who merely dropped the bombs.

[The Mad Monk]

Also, Israeli police official confirms the obvious: the kidnappings weren't ordered by Hamas.


It Turns Out Hamas Didn’t Kidnap and Kill the 3 Israeli Teens After All [Updated]

Oh yeah, about that...

Israeli Claim: Hamas Funded the Kidnapper Who Started the Gaza War
Israeli officials have not provided specifics publicly to support their claim that Hamas was responsible for the kidnapping that sparked the latest war. Until Tuesday.

Hamas funded the man who allegedly led the kidnapping ring that abducted three Israeli teens—and helped spark the latest Gaza war, in the process. But the accused kidnapper didn’t receive specific instructions from the militant group’s leadership in Gaza, an Israeli intelligence official tells The Daily Beast.

Three weeks ago, Israel’s internal security service arrested Hossam Qawasmeh, a man they are now claiming was the leader of the crew responsible for the kidnap and murder of Naftali Fraenkel, Eyal Yifrach, and Gilad Shaar.

However, the Shin Bet did not announce the arrest until Tuesday, only a few hours after Israel and Hamas agreed to a 72-hour ceasefire.

The news of the arrest and confession from Qawasmeh comes after some Western media outlets called into question whether the kidnappers in June were acting on behalf of Hamas leaders. Buzzfeed last week reported that some Israeli intelligence officers said the kidnappers—identified by Israel in June as Amer abu Aysha and Marwan Qawasmeh—were acting on their own.

Getting to the bottom of the kidnappings and murder is important to understanding the current war in Gaza that appears to be winding down this week. The kidnappings—for which Hamas leaders denied responsibility but nonetheless praised in public statements—sparked an Israeli campaign in the West Bank to disrupt the Hamas network there. In response, Hamas started firing rockets from Gaza into Israel. And then, Israeli forces began their bombing.

Israeli news reports say Qawasmeh acknowledged during interrogations that he received money and direction from Hamas leaders in Gaza to conduct the June 15 kidnapping. He was arrested trying to flee to Jordan using phony identification.

Shaul Bartal, an expert on Hamas and a reservist major in the Israel Defense Force for military intelligence, told The Daily Beast on Tuesday that the arrest of Qawasmeh was a smoking gun, but he also said it’s doubtful that Hamas leaders gave specific instructions to kidnap the three teenagers.

“It seems Hamas leadership in Gaza gave an order, but the order was more general,” he said.

Bartal just returned from 38 days of fighting near Gaza. He declined to say exactly what he was doing in the current war.

But he said that the Qawasmeh clan has had a long history of working closely with Hamas leadership. “They have received payments in the past from Hamas leaders in Gaza,” he said.

“There were always financial connections between the Qawasmeh families and Hamas,” he added. “I discovered a few years ago, people get money from Hamas leadership in Gaza to pay for children who died as martyrs. They always get money, we don’t always know how and why, but we know that they do.”

Shlomi Eldar, an Israeli journalist working for al-Monitor, wrote last month that members of the Qawasmeh family at times have conducted rogue attacks against the wishes of Hamas leaders. For example, in 2003, the Qawasmeh clan was responsible for a suicide bomb attack on the Number 2 bus in Jerusalem after there was a ceasefire endorsed by Hamas leadership.

Bartal, however, said this time Hamas was looking for a provocation. Hamas needed a spectacular operation in part to bolster its street credibility in light of elections tentatively scheduled for January 2015, he claimed.

“Under the unity agreement signed with Fatah there was supposed to be a January 2015 election,” Bartal said. “Hamas wanted a victory and popularity in the streets. If there is another prisoner release for Hamas, they would regain momentum.”

The best example of how kidnappings can be used as leverage to get Israel to release its prisoners is the kidnapping of Gilad Shalit, who was traded in 2011 for 1,027 prisoners after being held captive for five years.

Kidnappings have emerged as an important strategy for Hamas since the Shalit deal. The Shin Bet published on its website last month a timeline of thwarted kidnapping attempts on the West Bank that claimed Hamas tried on 10 occasions to kidnap Israelis since January.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/08/05/israeli-claim-hamas-funded-the-kidnapper-who-started-the-gaza-war.html

Connection, history of past behaviors, motive. Done.

[Sava]

False equivalence.

Only for people with ****ty morals

[Dinner]

keeping up your record nicely there i see oredin.

You're just plain wrong. Protected places which are used for military purposes lose all protection under the Geneva and Hague Conventions. Don't believe me? Fine. What about the International Red Cross?

http://www.icrc.org/customary-ihl/eng/docs/v2_cha_chapter2_rule10

It's time for you to man up and admit you've been completely wrong on this point.

[The Mad Monk]

AP ANALYSIS: Hamas emerges weakened from Gaza war
Associated Press
By KARIN LAUB and MOHAMMED DARAGHMEH 53 minutes ago

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip (AP) — Hamas has entered Egyptian-brokered talks with Israel on a new border regime for blockaded Gaza from a point of military weakness: it lost hundreds of fighters, two-thirds of its 10,000 rockets and all of its attack tunnels, worth $100 million, Israel says.

The Gaza war has boosted the Islamic militant group's popularity among Palestinians because it confronted Israel. But the mood can quickly turn if Hamas fails to deliver achievements for Gaza in the Cairo talks, most urgently the opening the territory's borders.

If the Cairo talks fail, Hamas will have only limited options, since resuming rocket fire would probably bring more ruination on an already-devastated territory. In the past month of Israel-Hamas fighting — the third major round of such hostilities in five years — nearly 1,900 Palestinians have been killed, more than 9,000 wounded and thousands of homes destroyed.

The massive destruction in Gaza City's neighborhood of Shijaiyah, close to the border with Israel, illustrated the extent of Hamas' military setbacks and the fickle public mood it faces.

Entire city blocks have been laid to waste in Shijaiyah in one of the fiercest battles of the war that pitted hundreds of Hamas gunmen against Israeli troops after the start of the Israeli ground operation July 17.

At least five of more than 30 cross-border military tunnels destroyed by Israel during the war had originated in Shijaiyah, and Hamas fought hard to protect the strategic assets, said Israeli military spokesman Lt. Col. Peter Lerner.

Shijaiyah resident Abdel Karim al-Ajla, 55, sat outside his destroyed two-story home with friends and relatives Wednesday, the second day of a temporary cease-fire that helped launch the indirect Israel-Hamas talks on Gaza's future.

"We paid a heavy price," said the English teacher. At the least, he said, "we hope now to open the borders."

However, Hamas can only meet such expectations by Gaza's people if it agrees to hand over some power to its long-time rival, Western-backed Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas.

Hamas had seized Gaza from Abbas in 2007, prompting Israel and Egypt to impose tight border restrictions. In any new deal negotiated in Cairo, Israel and Egypt would only agree to open the borders if forces loyal to Abbas take up positions at the Gaza crossings.

For years, Hamas had managed to survive the closure with the help of smuggling tunnels under the Egypt-Gaza border. The tunnels were tolerated by Egypt as a way of easing the plight of Gazans without formally opening the frontier.

But with the ouster of a Hamas-friendly government in Cairo last year, Hamas' prospects worsened dramatically. The Egyptian military, considering Hamas a security threat, destroyed the tunnels and deprived Hamas of key revenues from tunnel taxation.

The ensuing financial crisis drove Hamas to a lopsided power-sharing agreement with Abbas in April. Abbas took charge of a unity government of technocrats in both the West Bank and Gaza. Hamas stayed in the background, but won one major concession: continued control over its security forces in Gaza.

In the Cairo talks, Hamas could only win a seat at the table by agreeing to join a Palestinian delegation led by an Abbas confidant, a reflection of Egypt's tough stance toward the group.

The delegation has so far presented joint demands — a lifting of the closure and an international pledging conference for Gaza reconstruction — but Egypt has made it clear it considers the Abbas camp to be the legitimate voice of the Palestinians.

Israel's top demand in the Cairo talks is that Hamas be disarmed or at least be prevented from re-arming.

Israel has said it is willing, in principle, to ease Gaza border restrictions — but only with safeguards that prevent weapons or goods with possible military uses, such as cement for building tunnels and bunkers, from reaching Hamas.

Hamas has said it will not surrender its weapons under any circumstances. It has signaled some flexibility in letting Abbas take a lead on Gaza reconstruction but has also said it wants to retain a say.

Palestinian pollster Khalil Shikaki said the Gaza war appears to have boosted Hamas' popularity, but that this might be short-lived if Hamas is seen as impeding reconstruction. If Abbas leads the process effectively, he will get a lot of credit, Shikaki said. "Obviously, if Abbas makes unreasonable demands, such as disarming Hamas, then the public will side with Hamas," he said.

Ahmed Yousef, a Gaza intellectual and former Hamas government official, said he believes the movement is eager to unload the burden of government after its financial difficulties of recent months. "I see Hamas going back to the street, working with people," he said, suggesting the group might run for parliament in the future, but not try to return to government.

"Hamas has restored its popularity and will build on that," he said.

Any attempt by Hamas to rebuild its military capacity is being disrupted by the Egyptian tunnel closures. In the past, the tunnels funneled not just consumer goods, but also weapons from Iran and Syria and raw materials for a local arms industry.

Lerner, the Israeli military spokesman, said the Hamas rocket arsenal, estimated at 10,000, has been reduced by two-thirds. Hamas fired more than 3,300 rockets at Israel since July 8 and another 3,000 rockets were destroyed on the ground in Gaza by Israeli strikes, along with more than 1,000 launchers, he said.

Israel has also destroyed 32 tunnels under the Gaza-Israel border intended for staging attacks. Of those, 14 had already reached Israel, he said. With each concrete-lined tunnel costing about $3 million to dig, Hamas lost a strategic investment of about $100 million, he said. The tunnels were on average 2.5 to 3 kilometers (1.5 to 1.8 miles) long and took two to three years to build.

Lerner said Hamas' ability to manufacture rockets locally has also been hurt, with airstrikes destroying 191 sites linked to manufacturing.

However, the military option remains open if Hamas feels cornered.

The spokesman of the Hamas military wing, who goes by the nom de guerre Abu Obeida, said Wednesday the group still has plenty of reserves. "What we have shown in the war (in terms of weapons) is very little, and we will have a lot in our inventory," he said in a text message in response to a question also sent by text.

___

Daraghmeh reported from Ramallah, West Bank. Associated Press writer Ibrahim Barzak in Gaza City contributed to this report.

___

Laub leads coverage of the Palestinian territories and has reported on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict since 1987. Daraghmeh, based in the West Bank, has covered Palestinian affairs since 1996.

http://news.yahoo.com/ap-analysis-hamas-emerges-weakened-gaza-war-192801275.html

They could have built a hell of a lot of infrastructure with the $100 million dollars worth of materiel they wasted building those tunnels.

[C0ckney]

You're just plain wrong. Protected places which are used for military purposes lose all protection under the Geneva and Hague Conventions. Don't believe me? Fine. What about the International Red Cross?

http://www.icrc.org/customary-ihl/eng/docs/v2_cha_chapter2_rule10

It's time for you to man up and admit you've been completely wrong on this point.

from your link.

2. PracticeBy ChapterChapter 2Rule 10
Practice Relating to Rule 10. Civilian Objects’ Loss of Protection from Attack
Note: For practice concerning loss of protection from attack for medical units and transports and for objects displaying the distinctive emblems of the Geneva Conventions, see respectively Rules 28, 29 and 30.
Section A. Civilian objects used for military purposes
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I. Treaties
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VII. United Nations
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XI. International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement
ICRC
To fulfil its task of disseminating IHL, the ICRC has delegates around the world teaching armed and security forces that: “In case of doubt whether an object which is normally dedicated to civilian purposes (e.g. a place of worship, a house or other dwelling, a school) is a military objective, it shall be considered as a civilian object.”

you never fail.

[C0ckney]

oredin, weren't you involved in the propaganda (or physiological operations if you prefer) department in iraq? i think i'm starting to see why the west had so much trouble there.

[The Mad Monk]

If they are firing rockets from it, there is no doubt.