Please don't take this too seriously.

[Bereta_Eder]

Proxy relationships. It s not that uncommon but very toxic and counter productive. I will elaborate when i have a keyboard.

Tapatalk 2

[Lorizael]

That's part of the creepy aspect to me.

It still seems more than just friends to her. But as I said, I'm not an expert and despite your repeated attempts to explain it all, I can't know all the details.

We were more than friends to her. She just didn't believe "more than friends" necessarily meant "sexual relationship."

You.

Bah. I haven't done anything deserving of a

[rah]

Well you did create a plan and execute it.
Regardless of the results I think the effort deserved it.

[Lorizael]

Yeah, I've got a whole talk with my therapist planned out about how my friends being proud of me for asking someone out basically makes me feel like a ******.

[rah]

Being rejected never feels good but that can't stop you from asking someone in the future.

Most of us here recognize that. (especially since most of us have been rejected multiple times) And you probably should also.

My wife of almost 30 years was not the first woman I proposed to. being rejected there is much worse than being rejected for a date. And makes you feel even more retarded.
Fortunately I didn't let that deter me.

[Lorizael]

Oh, I feel bad about being rejected, but that's not what I'm referring to here. What I mean is my friends being proud of me feels like when parents congratulate their special needs kid for tying his shoes. I'm surrounded by kids who are eminently capable of asking someone out and who probably do it much more frequently than once or twice a decade. I was supposed to learn how to do this **** 10 or 15 years ago.

[rah]

We are not all so eminently capable as you seem to give us all credit for. Thank god I'm married because I would still find it difficult to ask a women out. Even after all these years.
I would bet that many here have agonized over it many times in their lives. Always being confident and never sweating the asking in the exception, not the rule.

[ricketyclik]

Practice is necessary.

[rah]

Lots and lots

[N35t0r]

What? Us? Friends?

[Elok]

My mother once met the late, great Albert Ellis. His catchphrase was "I will not should on myself," which would strike me as a lot cleverer if "I will not **** on myself" were something I'd actually heard anyone say, ever. But never mind that. The point of the saying is that it's stupid to measure yourself against other people. If only because you are very unlikely to have an accurate measure of their accomplishments. Let's face it, all of us work very hard to hide our deficiencies--and some of us work just as hard, and simultaneously, to hide our strengths in the name of modesty. Or exaggerate our strengths in the hope of getting ahead, or just make up our strengths because we're delusional about our own capabilities. Whichever one it happens to be, no one of us is really in a position to accurately evaluate the aptitudes of more than a tiny fraction of the people he meets every day.

[N35t0r]

I'll do the best I can, **** other people. Except my wife.

Wait, no, especially my wife.

[Elok]

To (unnecessarily) elaborate: how are you guesstimating your classmates' skill at asking each other out, Lori? I'm even more removed from the dating scene, assuming there is such a thing, than you are. But even when I was in college desperately lurching at any woman who got too close, I had no clue what made the sex lives of my classmates tick*. I suspect you're unconsciously taking cues from pop culture here. American pop culture is not known for giving people realistic expectations.

Anecdotal evidence: I never asked a single girl out in HS; I pined for various totally-wrong-for-me girls from a distance, except for my female best friend who I decided was too good for me (so she dated two or three jerks instead, not that I was much better). In college, I still fell for obviously wrong girls, but made the aforementioned painfully crude attempts to ask them out based on a passing acquaintance. I was shot down every time. Towards the end of my long collegiate sleepwalk, I asked out a more attainable woman, a pretty freshman. She said yes, but said let's be friends after the second date. A little while later, I moodily decided that twoo wuv was never going to happen and gave up trying. Shortly after that I met an interesting woman online, and got to talking on Yahoo Instant Messenger. She lived in Boston, so I had no real romantic expectations. We celebrated our fifth wedding anniversary this past September. She, too, had "dated" precisely one person before me. I assume that, if you asked the other happily-married Poly men, you would get a number of similarly weird stories.

*Alcohol, probably

[Lorizael]

Lori's Dating History: In 11th grade, a friend of my brothers' (and a classmate of mine) followed me home from school and nearly forced herself on me. We dated for 2 years. On my 19th birthday, my friends delivered to me a girl in a box. We dated for 2 years. In 2009, I actively pursued a member of my writing group and successfully began dating her after 4 months of wooing. We dated for 4 years. Last week, I asked out my TA. She said no.

My assumption is that most people have significantly more dating/asking out experience than I have, even if they don't necessarily have more relationship experience than I have. Your history matches up with that assumption.

(I'm leaving out a whole host of women I pined after but never actively pursued.)

[Elok]

I'm somewhat puzzled by your implication that my mental state at that time was something you should try to emulate. It wasn't confidence or maturity that drove me, just desperation. "Oh God, I'm so lonely--hey! Maybe this pretty girl I just met who happens to like one thing in common with me will be The One who will magically rescue me from a life of alienation HEY YOU WANT TO GO OUT SOMETIME? No? Damn. Oh God I'm so lonely--hey! Maybe this pretty girl. . ."

(repeat until finally disillusioned)