This is why I am opposed to privatized prisons.

[MrFun]

Not true at all, the other really - government agencies want more money = influence/power for their department.

Personally I'm not shocked to see this occur, but I don't think it's important in the big picture. Some people did something bad, got caught. I don't think this (or the reverse) is an argument for or against privatizing prisons; the other issues (for and against) are much more significant.

What is significant I think for discussion, is to what extent is our current prison system undermining justice and due process?

[MrFun]

Maybe if we changed how prison corporations were rewarded, this would be less of an issue. Pay them a flat fee to run the prison regardless of population, with bonuses for lower recidivism rates or something like that. One thing is for certain; neither public nor private prisons are doing what they need to be doing.

[kentonio]

How about stop trying to privatize things like your goddamn justice system. This 'profit above all' bull**** is ridiculous.

[rah]

If someone can do something at the same level of quality for less cost, why shouldn't the Government outsource it? The government has proven time an time again that they aren't always the most efficient when it comes to providing services. Taxpayers are the ones that pay in the long run.

[Hauldren Collider]

How about stop trying to privatize things like your goddamn justice system. This 'profit above all' bull**** is ridiculous.

It's not "profit above all", it's recognizing that the government sucks at a lot of stuff and dangling profit as an incentive is a great way to get people to do what you want.

[giblets]

Yes, although getting the incentive structure right for prisons might be tricky.

[snoopy369]

How about stop trying to privatize things like your goddamn justice system. This 'profit above all' bull**** is ridiculous.

It's not "profit above all". It's "Private corporations with a profit motive might do a better job of running this efficiently than the government". It is not in question that the government _is_ inefficient at doing nearly everything it does. The only question is whether the "profit motive" is sufficient to ensure the same _quality_ of service (or at least, a reasonable quality of service) is maintained for any given service. Prisons to me are a perfect example of something that the running of SHOULD be private - there is a huge amount of inefficiencies possible in a prison that can be culled by a reasonable business. The moral issue (is a prison something we are okay with a nongovernmental agency running, in the sense that they will have the power to physically restrain people etc.) is separate, and relevant; but in my mind there's little question that a government-run prison is very much more inefficient than a private one.

[rah]

Yes, although getting the incentive structure right for prisons might be tricky.

Agreed but I don't think a flat fee would be appropriate because of sliding expenses. Like food, and space.

[snoopy369]

If someone can do something at the same level of quality for less cost, why shouldn't the Government outsource it?

Maybe India would be willing to run our prisons for us?

[MrFun]

It's not "profit above all". It's "Private corporations with a profit motive might do a better job of running this efficiently than the government". It is not in question that the government _is_ inefficient at doing nearly everything it does. The only question is whether the "profit motive" is sufficient to ensure the same _quality_ of service (or at least, a reasonable quality of service) is maintained for any given service. Prisons to me are a perfect example of something that the running of SHOULD be private - there is a huge amount of inefficiencies possible in a prison that can be culled by a reasonable business. The moral issue (is a prison something we are okay with a nongovernmental agency running, in the sense that they will have the power to physically restrain people etc.) is separate, and relevant; but in my mind there's little question that a government-run prison is very much more inefficient than a private one.

There's also the problem of corporations buying judges when you have privatized prison complexes.

[rah]

Corruption can peak it's head anywhere. Do you think there's no graft and corruption in Government run prisons?
The solution is to investigate and punish those that do take advantage of it. It seems that was done here.

Heck look at all the corruption in Chicago. But check out how much money is saved through privatized garbage collection.

[DinoDoc]

Corruption can peak it's head anywhere.

OMG! THIS IS WHY I'M OPPOSED TO GOVERNMENT JAILS! OMG!!!!!!!!!

PS Serious question. Why are female guards at a men's jail?

[kentonio]

It's not "profit above all". It's "Private corporations with a profit motive might do a better job of running this efficiently than the government". It is not in question that the government _is_ inefficient at doing nearly everything it does. The only question is whether the "profit motive" is sufficient to ensure the same _quality_ of service (or at least, a reasonable quality of service) is maintained for any given service. Prisons to me are a perfect example of something that the running of SHOULD be private - there is a huge amount of inefficiencies possible in a prison that can be culled by a reasonable business. The moral issue (is a prison something we are okay with a nongovernmental agency running, in the sense that they will have the power to physically restrain people etc.) is separate, and relevant; but in my mind there's little question that a government-run prison is very much more inefficient than a private one.

Absolute and total nonsense. There is absolutely zero reason why a service should be more efficient in private hands than public (go take a look at your healthcare costs some time). Private industry virtually ensures a cutting of corners to maximize profit, which may be fine when you're selling coffee, or building PC's, but not so much when you're incarcerating prisoners and attempting to deal with their rehabilitation.

Basically this comes down to nothing more than the standard American fantasy that private industry = good, public service = bad. A corporation just bribed judges to imprison children, and instead of stopping and asking yourselves what the hell are you getting yourselves into, you all just sit around talking about how you might reword the contracts to make them work better.

Absolutely shameful.

[kentonio]

It's not "profit above all", it's recognizing that the government sucks at a lot of stuff and dangling profit as an incentive is a great way to get people to do what you want.

If the government sucks at a lot of things, it's because you idiots don't hold your government responsible when things go wrong, and instead just sit back *****ing about it. Grow some balls and take some responsibility rather than sitting back and hoping some profit driven businessman is going to wave a magic ****ing wand and suddenly cure all your countries problems.

[Hauldren Collider]

Yes, although getting the incentive structure right for prisons might be tricky.

Agreed. I'm not sure it can really be done. But some states have such horrible prison systems I think it's unlikely that a reasonable attempt at a private system would be worse.