Do you support Rush Limbaugh's proposal?

[kentonio]

No, it doesn't help her achieve her goals. I am making blanket statements about the wrongness not only of the actions against her, but of her own actions (in many cases).

The debate is now not about Sandra Fluke, its about Michelle Malkin. Yes you helped her achieve her goal.

I am simply not being a hypocrite who ignores X if "my side" does it, while going ballistic about X if "their side" does it.

IT IS ALWAYS WRONG WHOEVER DOES IT, WHOEVER THE TARGET IS. It isn't about sides, it's about consistency. And you were trying to justify the attacks against her by pretending they were deserved. You were wrong to do so, and I'm glad you're moving away from your arguments now and trying to pretend my statements you've been arguing against are in fact, indisputable. Thank you

No, I genuinely did not need your help to see that racism is a bad thing.

[DaShi]

He's in his own world now. There's no reaching him.

[Aeson]

Let's recap here..

Innocent student gets called a slut and a prostitute by leading GOP media celebrity who is also known for his racist views.

GOP musters just enough enthusiasm to call Limbaugh's comments 'innappropiate'...

Michelle Malkin previously known for her racially motivated attacks and desire to disriminate against American citizens based purely on their race says that she has been racially insulted in the past.

Suddenly it doesn't matter that an innocent student was attacked by a GOP hate monger because we should all instead start feeling sorry for Michelle ****ing Malkin?

No. All my statements in this thread apply to things Rush said about the innocent student too. I am not justifying it, I am condeming it with every post. I just do so consistently whoever the target is. You just aren't bright enough to realize the applicability of the statements.

You were trying to justify the exact sort of attacks against Malkin that you condemn in regards to the student. You were being a hypocrite by saying Malkin has not right to complain about those types of attacks made against her. She definitely does, because it's always wrong.

[Aeson]

The debate is now not about Sandra Fluke, its about Michelle Malkin. Yes you helped her achieve her goal.

No, the debate is about whether or not it is ever justifiable to make those sorts of attacks. My claim has been consistently that it's not.

No, I genuinely did not need your help to see that racism is a bad thing.

You claimed she had no right to point out that it was a bad thing. Obviously you needed my help (and the help of others) to get to this point where you now accept it was something she did not deserve. (If you are admitting such.)

[DaShi]

I don't see where Kentonio claimed she had no right to complain.

[Aeson]

Where are these great attacks on gender/ethnicity here that the great white knight, Aeson has come down from his high horse to lecture all of us?

In the article Ozzy posted, duh.

[Aeson]

I don't see where Kentonio claimed she had no right to complain.

"If you choose to start trench fighting, then you don't get to turn around and cry about how mean people are to you. "

[DaShi]

So it's Ozzy you are lecturing? Strange, it felt like it was me for some reason.

[kentonio]

You claimed she had no right to point out that it was a bad thing. Obviously you needed my help (and the help of others) to get to this point where you now accept it was something she did not deserve. (If you are admitting such.)

No I did not say that. I said that it was bad but that as she chooses to attack people herself, often using race as a tool in her own attacks, that she deserves less sympathy than an innocent student. Maybe if you spent a bit more time looking for nuance, and a little less claiming that you are cleverer than everybody else, you might be able to see the difference.

[Aeson]

So it's Ozzy you are lecturing? Strange, it felt like it was me for some reason.

It is the people who made attacks against Malkin that I am referencing. It is you I am attacking for being so dense as to not realize that it's perfectly ok to point out that those attacks are not justified.

You want to pretend like my blanket statments against attacks on gender or ethnicity is somehow defending Malkin's attacks on gender or ethnicity in the past. Kentonio wants to pretend I'm justifying Rush's statements. You both are confused and seem to think this is some sort of team vs team thing and if you point out something wrong on "your team" you are justifying the other team.

The reality is that attacks on gender or ethnicity are always wrong. ALways. Doesn't matter if it's your side or not. And to be consistent you have to apply that to your team, their team, yourself, or anyone. Doing so isn't justifying it, it's condemning it.

[Aeson]

No I did not say that. I said that it was bad but that as she chooses to attack people herself, often using race as a tool in her own attacks, that she deserves less sympathy than an innocent student. Maybe if you spent a bit more time looking for nuance, and a little less claiming that you are cleverer than everybody else, you might be able to see the difference.

"If you choose to start trench fighting, then you don't get to turn around and cry about how mean people are to you. "

In that statement you're clearly saying she doesn't have the right to complain about unjust attacks against her.

[DaShi]

"If you choose to start trench fighting, then you don't get to turn around and cry about how mean people are to you. "

He explained that quite clearly:

"If you think that Malkin suddenly felt the need to mention this stuff as anything other than a way to deflect some well deserved blame away from the GOP, then you're mistaken."

"Except it's now being used to excuse Limbaugh and his GOP puppets behaviour. Since when was 'well someone else did it first' a justifiable excuse for any grown up, let alone prominent national media figures?"

In fact, in context, it's quite clear what he was talking about:

"No I don't think it's alright, but I also don't spare much sympathy for a woman who has made a career out of hate filled attacks of her own."

[kentonio]

"If you choose to start trench fighting, then you don't get to turn around and cry about how mean people are to you. "

In that statement you're clearly saying she doesn't have the right to complain about unjust attacks against her.

Actually I was implying that she can't expect to get outpourings of sympathy when she uses comparable tactics herself. That is not the same thing as saying that the attacks themselves are fine.

[DaShi]

It is the people who made attacks against Malkin that I am referencing. It is you I am attacking for being so dense as to not realize that it's perfectly ok to point out that those attacks are not justified.

You want to pretend like my blanket statments against attacks on gender or ethnicity is somehow defending Malkin's attacks on gender or ethnicity in the past. Kentonio wants to pretend I'm justifying Rush's statements. You both are confused and seem to think this is some sort of team vs team thing and if you point out something wrong on "your team" you are justifying the other team.

And my argument has been consistent that it is not right to use the attacks of other to justify to obfuscate your own attacks. I've have not once disagreed with your blanket statement of gender and ethnic attacks are wrong. However, I do disagree with you using that as a club to beat others with.

[DaShi]

Actually I was implying that she can't expect to get outpourings of sympathy when she uses comparable tactics herself. That is not the same thing as saying that the attacks themselves are fine.

It's very clear in context, but it is important to know that Aeson is very sensitive.