How famous are Cristiano Ronaldo and Messi in the USA?

[Elok]

I was under the impression that there was very little in the way of historical records to go by in any case. I.e., we have records of some guy named Jeshua getting crucified during Pilate's rule, and we have the Gospels, and that's about it. Nothing in there to indicate that Pilate was or wasn't under political pressure from the Jewish hierarchy. And it's not just that one line; you'd have to rewrite half of all four Gospels to remove all the implications that the Sanhedrin et al were involved in Christ's crucifixion. Be that as it may, all I wanted to say was that Matthew 27 makes a very poor justification for antisemitism from a theological POV. Which, of course, did not stop some from trying, and some from succeeding.

By the by, there's really no need to call me/my beliefs daft, or otherwise insult me. I'm not Kid, I've been pretty civil in this conversation so far. Or so I think.

[Al B. Sure!]

****ing Amazing...

[Jon Miller]

I was under the impression that there was very little in the way of historical records to go by in any case. I.e., we have records of some guy named Jeshua getting crucified during Pilate's rule, and we have the Gospels, and that's about it. Nothing in there to indicate that Pilate was or wasn't under political pressure from the Jewish hierarchy. And it's not just that one line; you'd have to rewrite half of all four Gospels to remove all the implications that the Sanhedrin et al were involved in Christ's crucifixion. Be that as it may, all I wanted to say was that Matthew 27 makes a very poor justification for antisemitism from a theological POV. Which, of course, did not stop some from trying, and some from succeeding.

By the by, there's really no need to call me/my beliefs daft, or otherwise insult me. I'm not Kid, I've been pretty civil in this conversation so far. Or so I think.

A few decades later, we have information about accusations from non-Christians that the disciples hid the body.

We have more than just records of Pilate's rule and the gospels. We have the accusations of the Jews of that time.

JM

[Elok]

Ah. See, I haven't really done research on this, it's just what I happened to hear/read over the course of ten thousand internet arguments.

[Kidlicious]

I was under the impression that there was very little in the way of historical records to go by in any case. I.e., we have records of some guy named Jeshua getting crucified during Pilate's rule, and we have the Gospels, and that's about it. Nothing in there to indicate that Pilate was or wasn't under political pressure from the Jewish hierarchy. And it's not just that one line; you'd have to rewrite half of all four Gospels to remove all the implications that the Sanhedrin et al were involved in Christ's crucifixion. Be that as it may, all I wanted to say was that Matthew 27 makes a very poor justification for antisemitism from a theological POV. Which, of course, did not stop some from trying, and some from succeeding.

By the by, there's really no need to call me/my beliefs daft, or otherwise insult me. I'm not Kid, I've been pretty civil in this conversation so far. Or so I think.

I've been taking MB's crap for awhile. It's just trolling anyway. You're no better than I am. Let's see how long you can take it then judge me jerk!

[Kidlicious]

A few decades later, we have information about accusations from non-Christians that the disciples hid the body.

We have more than just records of Pilate's rule and the gospels. We have the accusations of the Jews of that time.

JM

Both were responsible, but one sin was greater than the other.

[Kidlicious]

I'm astonished. Not only are you now a Christian, you are also a medically qualified psychiatrist !

Or are you using 'psychopath' in its loose sense of 'Anyone I think is horrible and would like to think is an atheist' ?

Do you think a psychopath believes in God?

[MikeH]

Cows eat grass.
That thing over there is eating grass. Therefore it's a cow.

[Kidlicious]

I'm not saying that means Hitler was a psychopath. I think it's just stupi to say that he wasn't, just as it's stupid to say that he was a christian. It makes sense though to say he was an atheist.

[molly bloom]

By the by, there's really no need to call me/my beliefs daft, or otherwise insult me.

I'm not aware of having insulted you. Transsubstantiation is a different matter- I'm not actually aware of it forming a core part of your beliefs.

If you've told me it has in the past, and I've forgotten, then I apologize for inadvertently offending you. Steer clear though, of large groups of nonconformist/Protestant Christians who don't believe in it either.

I was under the impression that there was very little in the way of historical records to go by in any case.

We know who ruled which area in Palestine and when. We know who would have been responsible for trying someone like Jesus, and we know why the punishment of crucifixion was used and for whom. We also know that Pilate had no fears of the Jewish hierarchy or the Jewish populace (from other actions of his).

[Elok]

Well, actual transubstantiation is an RCC doctrine, but the Orthodox do believe that it's really him in there, yes. Apology accepted, though perhaps I got offended over nothing anyway.

[MikeH]

It makes sense though to say he was an atheist.

The evidence is he wasn't. It's stupid to say he was an athiest.

[molly bloom]

Do you think a psychopath believes in God?

I haven't interviewed any declared psychopaths. Have you ?

You seem to be involved in some kind of twisted logic here- if someone believes in god (a god ? Any god ? Gods plural ?) then they can't be a psychopath- unless presumably it's a god you don't approve of.

If someone is a psychopath- (according to your fuzzy non-definition) then they can't believe in a god. Why, I'm not sure.

I'm not saying that means Hitler was a psychopath.

So it was your evil psychopath twin who stated:

They (Hitler & Stalin) were psychopaths

Oh my.

I think it's just stupi to say that he wasn't (a psychopath)

Or stupid to say that his Roman Catholic upbringing had no influence on his later anti-semitism. You are aware of the centuries old history of antisemitism in the Christian churches and countries ?

just as it's stupid to say that he was a christian.

He was baptised a Catholic. There's no evidence he gave up a faith in a supernatural being for rationalism or atheism. You're simply making an assumption.

It makes sense though to say he was an atheist.

That's simply illogical and stupid, not to mention unhistorical. I won't say it's offensive, because it's too sad and pathetic to be abusive, and I'm not a representative for all atheists or agnostics..

[molly bloom]

Well, actual transubstantiation is an RCC doctrine, but the Orthodox do believe that it's really him in there, yes. Apology accepted, though perhaps I got offended over nothing anyway.

Elok, believe me, if I wanted to offend you, then as a lapsed Catholic who knows a fair bit about the Christian faith and its history, I'm sure I could dig up some crude impolite comments designed purposefully to annoy you. But to what end ? I enjoy your perspectives on an area of Christian faith with which I'm not too familiar (outside of early Roman/Byzantine history).

And besides I like avgolemono, Byzantine chant and Milton. How many people am I gonna discuss that lot with on a regular basis ?

[Kidlicious]

The evidence is he wasn't. It's stupid to say he was an athiest.

Um... no. The evidence proves he was an atheist. There never was such an atheist.