Chickenpox Lollipops

[The Mad Monk]

x-perverted panda

John 15
The Vine and the Branches
1 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2 He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes[a] so that it will be even more fruitful. 3 You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you. 4 Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.
5 “I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6 If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. 7 If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 8 This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.

He's still there.

[Imran Siddiqui]

How can the vengeful god of the old testament who was fond of direct intervention and smiting be the same as the caring, huggy god of the new testament? What changed?

We did and how we viewed God. A failing of (some) atheists is that they believe that the God of the Old Testament is always seen the same, as the God who orders the destruction of Sodom and Gomorra or those who tells Joshua to kill the Caananites. However, the Old Testament shows a progression and Isreal's view of God is evolving all throughout. They see Him and understand Him in a new light.

[Kidlicious]

He still trims the vine, and he always will. He will come like a thief in the night much like he destryoed Sodom because it was evil.

[GoldenTers]

Hi all
New user here.

[kentonio]

Hi. Do you feel like you've just entered Beirut yet?

[The Mad Monk]

...because everyone's fighting, but really ganging up on the Christians?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Well played

[molly bloom]

And why isn't this increase in knowledge done with God working in the background?

It isn't a necessary prerequisite.

Our understanding of God may have evolved, but God has always remained the same

The Assyrians, Egyptians, Moabites, etc, would disagree (all those supposedly smote by the angry God of the Old Testament).

In modern times (and indeed if we go a little further back) God neglected to smite the likes of Genghis Khan, Timur Lenk, and so forth, no matter how many observant Christians (or Jews) they killed. Perhaps in the many conflicts of Christian versus Christian it may have been harder for God to pick a side more deserving- Torquemada or Cromwell ? Gustavus Adolphus or the Cardinal Infante ?

In addition, God reveals himself to us based on what we are ready for - Ancient Near Eastern Jews had one set of understandings

They seemed to be quite familiar with trances and healing through them.

A God who came and stressed peace and love would have been seen as weak without establishing that He was also just

And yet Matthew's Gospel is full of extreme pacifism- certainly in comparison even with the Essenes (who carried weapons for self-protection only).

You may try as you might to "explain" healings and raisings from the dead, as modernist minds attempt to do. However, I'm not sure if you think you'll get anywhere. As I'd imagine that myself, Jon Miller, Kid, and Elok find your explainations lacking.

I'd rather attempt a rational explanation for what is organically and clinically possible (and has been demonstrated to have occurred through human intervention), than have to invoke supernatural causes. Occam's razor, and all that.

[molly bloom]

We know that you think your logic is perfect. Why do you keep saying so?

You don't 'know' anything of the sort. You're being presumptuous and a trifle vain.

[molly bloom]

How can the vengeful god of the old testament who was fond of direct intervention and smiting be the same as the caring, huggy god of the new testament? What changed?

Jews 0, Roman Empire 3 .

[molly bloom]

We did and how we viewed God. A failing of (some) atheists is that they believe that the God of the Old Testament is always seen the same, as the God who orders the destruction of Sodom and Gomorra or those who tells Joshua to kill the Caananites. However, the Old Testament shows a progression and Isreal's view of God is evolving all throughout. They see Him and understand Him in a new light.

Any view or concept of a god is bound to evolve as its believers change, from the early sacrifice demanding god of nomads to the god of a settled people.

[Kidlicious]

Jews 0, Roman Empire 3 .

Do you even read posts that don't agree with your worldview? It's the same God. He hasn't changed.

[molly bloom]

Do you even read posts that don't agree with your worldview? It's the same God. He hasn't changed.

Yeah, 'cos you were there in the beginning too. Did you take a Polaroid camera and make notes too ?

Archaeopteryx in da house!

[Kidlicious]

It isn't a necessary prerequisite.



The Assyrians, Egyptians, Moabites, etc, would disagree (all those supposedly smote by the angry God of the Old Testament).

In modern times (and indeed if we go a little further back) God neglected to smite the likes of Genghis Khan, Timur Lenk, and so forth, no matter how many observant Christians (or Jews) they killed. Perhaps in the many conflicts of Christian versus Christian it may have been harder for God to pick a side more deserving- Torquemada or Cromwell ? Gustavus Adolphus or the Cardinal Infante ?



They seemed to be quite familiar with trances and healing through them.



And yet Matthew's Gospel is full of extreme pacifism- certainly in comparison even with the Essenes (who carried weapons for self-protection only).



I'd rather attempt a rational explanation for what is organically and clinically possible (and has been demonstrated to have occurred through human intervention), than have to invoke supernatural causes. Occam's razor, and all that.

You can't claim Occam's Razor or rationality if you can't even explain your beliefs. How do you have free will? Are you a self? etc... If you can't explain these things you aren't being rational.

[Kidlicious]

Yeah, 'cos you were there in the beginning too. Did you take a Polaroid camera and make notes too ?

Archaeopteryx in da house!

I'll take that as a no.