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  • Yep, the dependency thing is a valid question, and I read an interesting piece about this - from a left-libertarian Marxist, no less.



    Tuesday 9 August 2011
    London’s burning: a mob made by the welfare state
    Yes, there’s a ‘political context’ to the riots: it is that British youth have been so suckled by the state they have zero sense of community spirit.
    Brendan O’Neill

    Many commentators are on a mission to contextualise the riots that have swept parts of urban London and other British cities. ‘It’s very naive to look at these riots without the context’, says one journalist, who says the reason the violence kicked off in the London suburb of Tottenham is because ‘that area is getting 75% cuts [in public services]’. Others have said that the political context for the rioting is youth unemployment or working-class anger at David Cameron’s cuts agenda. ‘There is a context to London’s riots that can’t be ignored’, said a writer for the Guardian, and it is the ‘backdrop of brutal cuts and enforced austerity measures’. The ‘mass unrest’ is a protest against unhinged capitalism, apparently.

    These observers are right that there is a political context to the riots. They are right to argue that while the police shooting of young black man Mark Duggan may ostensibly have been the trigger for the street violence, there is a broader context to the disturbances. But they are wrong about what the political context is. Painting these riots as some kind of action replay of historic political streetfights against capitalist bosses or racist cops might allow armchair radicals to get their intellectual rocks off, as they lift their noses from dusty tomes about the Levellers or the Suffragettes and fantasise that a political upheaval of equal worth is now occurring outside their windows. But such shameless projection misses what is new and peculiar and deeply worrying about these riots. The political context is not the cuts agenda or racist policing – it is the welfare state, which, it is now clear, has nurtured a new generation that has absolutely no sense of community spirit or social solidarity.

    What we have on the streets of London and elsewhere are welfare-state mobs. The youth who are ‘rising up’ – actually they are simply shattering their own communities – represent a generation that has been more suckled by the state than any generation before it. They live in those urban territories where the sharp-elbowed intrusion of the welfare state over the past 30 years has pushed aside older ideals of self-reliance and community spirit. The march of the welfare state into every aspect of less well-off urban people’s existences, from their financial wellbeing to their childrearing habits and even into their emotional lives, with the rise of therapeutic welfarism designed to ensure that the poor remain ‘mentally fit’, has helped to undermine such things as individual resourcefulness and social bonding. The anti-social youthful rioters look to me like the end product of such an anti-social system of state intervention.

    The most striking thing about the rioters is how little they seem to care for their own communities. You don’t have to be a right-winger with helmet hair and a niggling discomfort with black or chavvy yoof (I am the opposite of that) to recognise that this violence is not political, just criminal. It is entertaining to watch the political contortionism of those commentators who claim that the riots are an uprising against the evils of capitalism, as they struggle to explain why the targets thus far have been Foot Locker sports shops, electrical goods shops, takeaway joints and bus-stops, and why the only ‘gains’ made by the rioters have been to get a new pair of trainers or an Apple laptop. In past episodes of rioting, for example during the Brixton race riots of 1981, looting and the destruction of local infrastructure were largely incidental to the broader expression of political anger, byproducts of the main show, which was a clash between a community and the forces of the state. But in these new riots, smashing stuff up is all there is. It is childish nihilism.

    Many older members of the urban communities rocked by violence have been shocked by the level of self-destruction exhibited by the rioters. Some shop-owners have got together to defend their property, even beating up rioters who have turned up with iron bars. In one video doing the rounds on social-networking sites, a West Indian woman in her fifties braves the rubble-strewn streets to lecture the rioters: ‘These people worked hard to make their businesses work and you lot wanna go and burn it up. For what?’ On Twitter, the hashtag #riotcleanup is being used by community members to coordinate some post-riot street-cleaning, to make amends for what one elderly Tottenham resident described as ‘the stupid behaviour of the young’.

    But it’s more than childish destructiveness motivating the rioters. At a more fundamental level, these are youngsters who are uniquely alienated from the communities they grew up in. Nurtured in large part by the welfare state, financially, physically and educationally, socialised more by the agents of welfarism than by their own neighbours or community representatives, these youth have little moral or emotional attachment to the areas they grew up in. Their rioting reveals, not that Britain is in a time warp back to 1981 or 1985 when there were politically motivated, anti-racist riots against the police, but rather that the tentacle-like spread of the welfare state into every area of people’s lives has utterly zapped old social bonds, the relationship of sharing and solidarity that once existed in working-class communities. In communities that are made dependent upon the state, people are less inclined to depend on each other or on their own social wherewithal. We have a saying in Britain for people who undermine their own living quarters – we call it ‘****ting on your own doorstep’. And this rioting suggests that the welfare state has given rise to a generation perfectly happy to do that.

    This is not a political rebellion; it is a mollycoddled mob, a riotous expression of carelessness for one’s own community. And as a left-winger, I refuse to celebrate nihilistic behaviour that has a profoundly negative impact on working people’s lives. Far from being an instance of working-class action, the welfare-state mob has more in common with what Marx described as the lumpenproletariat. Indeed, it is worth recalling Marx’s colourful description in The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Napoleon of how that French ruler cynically built his power base amongst parts of the bourgeoisie and sections of the lumpenproletariat, so that ‘ruined and adventurous offshoots of the bourgeoisie rubbed shoulders with vagabonds, discharged soldiers, discharged jailbirds, swindlers, pickpockets, tricksters, gamblers, brothel-keepers, organ-grinders, ragpickers, knife-grinders, tinkers, beggars… and from this kindred element Boneparte formed the core of his [constituency], where all its members felt the need to benefit themselves at the expense of the labouring nation.’ In very different circumstances, we have something similar today – when the decadent commentariat’s siding with lumpen rioters represents a weird coming together of sections of the bourgeoisie with sections of the underworked and the over-flattered, as the rest of us, ‘the labouring nation’, look on with disdain.

    There is one more important part to this story: the reaction of the cops. Their inability to handle the riots effectively reveals the extent to which the British police are far better adapted to consensual policing than conflictual policing. It also demonstrates how far they have been paralysed in our era of the politics of victimhood, where virtually no police activity fails to get followed up by a complaint or a legal case. Their kid-glove approach to the rioters of course only fuels the riots, because as one observer put it, when the rioters ‘see that the police cannot control the situation, [that] leads to a sort of adrenalin-fuelled euphoria’. So this street violence was largely ignited by the excesses of the welfare state and was then intensified by the discombobulation of the police state. In this sense, it reveals something very telling, and quite depressing, about modern Britain.

    Brendan O’Neill is editor of spiked. Visit his personal website here.

    reprinted from:

    Comment


    • Originally posted by notyoueither View Post
      Back to the topic of the thread.

      Does it look like the riots will stop, or will there be another round tonight?
      It's already kicked off in a couple of locations in and around Manchester, and also in the West Midlands. As I type I haven't heard of anything in London, but it's early days. It may be that the substantial increase in police presence as helped here, but we'll see. On the bright side, there's a sense of 'blitz spirit' community emerging to some extent. There's twitter hashtags by district/neighbourhood popping up with local people coming together. The downside of Twitter is that a lot of idiots are spreading panic by inventing and propagating unsubstantiated rumours.

      Thanks for bringing it back on topic.

      Comment


      • Responding to post #121

        We avoid that in Canada (Alberta at least) by making it very difficult for able bodied people to remain on welfare programs for any length of time.

        It may be easier here due to the nature of our economy. My impression is that the resource extraction industries make our workforce much more dynamic.
        (\__/)
        (='.'=)
        (")_(") This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination.

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        • The very real fear here is that any reduction in welfare entitlements might spur people to ...erm, riot.

          The ending of payments to teenage schoolkids, for example, just for staying in education, has been cited as a 'provocation' to the violence by those who believe that the latest phone, tv and trainers are their entitlement. Likewise with the spending cuts which have hardly really started yet and are only likely to get a lot worse.

          Comment


          • Sums up my view:



            Riots caused by society or lazy, thieving ******, say experts
            09-08-11

            THE London riots are the inevitable consequence of a society that includes some arseholes who like to steal things instead of working, experts claimed last night.

            Sociologists said the devastation across the capital was the direct result of either social exclusion and government cutbacks or some young, inner-city ****** finding a flimsy excuse to set fire to Carpetright.
            One day Canada will rule the world, and then we'll all be sorry.

            Comment


            • good article cort, i agree with pretty much all of it.

              it's certainly great to see people coming together to help their communities. hopefully things will calm down soon.
              "The Christian way has not been tried and found wanting, it has been found to be hard and left untried" - GK Chesterton.

              "The most obvious predicition about the future is that it will be mostly like the past" - Alain de Botton

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Cort Haus View Post
                The very real fear here is that any reduction in welfare entitlements might spur people to ...erm, riot.

                The ending of payments to teenage schoolkids, for example, just for staying in education, has been cited as a 'provocation' to the violence by those who believe that the latest phone, tv and trainers are their entitlement. Likewise with the spending cuts which have hardly really started yet and are only likely to get a lot worse.

                Yeah. I've been getting that impression as I watch coverage of riots when austerity measures are introduced in places like Greece, etc. Now they are coming to London.

                We never went that far down the nanny-state road.

                Minors with no decent family may be given welfare for the time needed to finish high school. Students can borrow and enjoy a subsidised university education. But the model is 'you work,' and not much is free.

                Welfare for the able bodied could never come close to providing a living. Employment Insurance is used as the safety valve for the working class. However, even in economically depressed areas, the benefits run out and the only way to get them back is to complete a period of employment.

                The short of it is: you work. We will help people who run into a hard time, and those who are unable to work. Everybody else: work or... there are not a lot of alternatives (and none state-sanctioned).
                (\__/)
                (='.'=)
                (")_(") This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by onodera View Post
                  No tear gas or rubber bullets have been used yet? I was going to propose sending in the army and they haven't used anything yet? The Met must be full of pussies. We should send some of our riot control policemen to show how to deal with rioters.
                  See the last para of the article I posted.

                  We have no recent history of water cannon, CS gas, rubber & plastic bullets being used on the UK mainland (though we have in Northern Ireland), and there is great reluctance to do so. There have been recent incidents of police killing people, including possibly the spark for all this unrest (the guy was armed but almost certainly didn't use it - although he might have drawn it - we just don't know), the death of a passer-by in a recent eco/anti-City protest demo, and of course the notorious de Menezes incident - which have lead to great criticism of the police. So it's not easy for them to steam in without risking their own careers, which is partly why they've been pussying around here. Lack of numbers is another reason. They didn't have the resources to beat, detain, arrest, transport charge and cell people while simultaneously maintaining a presence at the confrontation. This is because their numbers were too few, and too few of them are allowed to be active in mass civil disorder. So resourcing and policies have played a part.

                  They are capable of beating the **** out of people when they really want to, including innocent people. However, I witnessed a case of a couple of community support officers (not real coppers) apprehending a suspect a few months ago, and the kid was going mental at them. I was with three friends - a Pole, a Bulgarian and a Brazilian - and they were all amazed at how their suspect was allowed to behave without being put on the ground and having the **** kicked out of him. So in many ways, the Police here do not exert the physical authority that is expected elsewhere.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by onodera View Post
                    No tear gas or rubber bullets have been used yet? I was going to propose sending in the army and they haven't used anything yet? The Met must be full of pussies. We should send some of our riot control policemen to show how to deal with rioters.
                    Didn't you throw guys throw grenades into a room full of Chechen schoolchildren once?
                    If there is no sound in space, how come you can hear the lasers?
                    ){ :|:& };:

                    Comment


                    • ...Hey, if someone gave me teh chance to set fire to Carpetright, I'd take them up on it.
                      You just wasted six ... no, seven ... seconds of your life reading this sentence.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Cort Haus View Post
                        They are capable of beating the **** out of people when they really want to, including innocent people. However, I witnessed a case of a couple of community support officers (not real coppers) apprehending a suspect a few months ago, and the kid was going mental at them. I was with three friends - a Pole, a Bulgarian and a Brazilian - and they were all amazed at how their suspect was allowed to behave without being put on the ground and having the **** kicked out of him. So in many ways, the Police here do not exert the physical authority that is expected elsewhere.
                        The way that UK law is set up with regard to Assault and Battery is actually really bad, especially when it's legal under certain rather flimsy circumstances.
                        You just wasted six ... no, seven ... seconds of your life reading this sentence.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Hauldren Collider View Post
                          Didn't you throw guys throw grenades into a room full of Chechen schoolchildren once?
                          Let's leave Chechnya out of this please.

                          Comment


                          • "The way we police in Britain is not through use of water cannon," she said. "The way we police in Britain is through consent of communities."


                            This is crazy. Is it going to take mobs reaching Belgravia and Kensington before the police react with a major show of force to restore order?
                            I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                            For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

                            Comment


                            • The mobs won't touch there.
                              One day Canada will rule the world, and then we'll all be sorry.

                              Comment


                              • The community hasn't consented to using water cannons at this point? Really?

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