Thread in which the world laughs at America

[Jon Miller]

After the behavior of the Republicans this summer, I don't blame him.

They would definitely win any game of playing chicken.

JM

[Hauldren Collider]

Are you gonna argue with The Dukes Of Hazard?

[Hauldren Collider]

After the behavior of the Republicans this summer, I don't blame him.

They would definitely win any game of playing chicken.

JM

That's because he's terrible at negotiations and his positions have been absurd. He first wanted a clean debt increase, with no attached spending cuts. Since then how many times has he waffled?

[DaShi]

Indeed, he's been willing to give far too much to the right.

[The Mad Monk]

Anyone remember that debate way back in 2008, when both candidates were asked what they would cut if they were forced to make deep cuts?

Remember Obama's answer?

Yeah. He couldn't get away with that again if this was staring him in the face.

[DaShi]

Not everyone agrees that the deficit is the biggest problem right now. In fact, most Americans would rather have the president and congress focus on job creation than reduce spending.

[Elok]

Not if I have something to say about it. You belong here.

Perhaps, but spending extended periods of time here tends to make me start exhibiting the behavior seen in posts 128-131 of this thread. Maybe after Weelok is born, I'll have less desire to act infantile myself.

There's an article on Slate that tends more towards the former, without entirely ruling out the later. Under any definition, it would be doubleplus ungood.

Could you link me to that? All I'm seeing is an article estimating how much cash the feds currently have, which isn't really the same. I'm guessing your article got buried when the Norway attacks happened. Instead they've got Chris Hitchens on the front page decrying reflexive Muslim-bashing. Perhaps next week they'll have the Pope denouncing obstruction of justice, or GWB criticizing Obama for invading Libya...

I'm gonna defer to Imran and the rest of the Polytubbie legal squad on this question, but I like the cut of your jib.

Thank you. Ogie provided a decent alternative. Any others?

[Guynemer]

Could you link me to that? All I'm seeing is an article estimating how much cash the feds currently have, which isn't really the same. I'm guessing your article got buried when the Norway attacks happened. Instead they've got Chris Hitchens on the front page decrying reflexive Muslim-bashing. Perhaps next week they'll have the Pope denouncing obstruction of justice, or GWB criticizing Obama for invading Libya...

I was making a joke, sadly.


Yeah, that Hitch article has me feeling a little lightheaded. I wonder if cancer has mellowed him out.

[The Mad Monk]

Let's see how this develops.

Posted at 08:00 AM ET, 07/25/2011
White House stokes debt-ceiling crisis
By Jennifer Rubin
A Republican aide e-mails me: “The Speaker, Sen. Reid and Sen. McConnell all agreed on the general framework of a two-part plan. A short-term increase (with cuts greater than the increase), combined with a committee to find long-term savings before the rest of the increase would be considered. Sen. Reid took the bipartisan plan to the White House and the President said no.”

If this is accurate the president is playing with fire. By halting a bipartisan deal he imperils the country’s finances and can rightly be accused of putting partisanship above all else. The ONLY reason to reject a short-term, two-step deal embraced by both the House and Senate is to avoid another approval-killing face-off for President Obama before the election. Next to pulling troops out of Afghanistan to fit the election calendar, this is the most irresponsible and shameful move of his presidency.

As for the House, why not pass the deal that Sen. Harry Reid agreed to, send it to the Senate and leave town? Enough already.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/post/white-house-stokes-debt-ceiling-crisis/2011/03/29/gIQAvx8DYI_blog.html

[The Mad Monk]

Boehner, Reid preparing to move on debt limit
By ALAN FRAM Associated Press
Posted: 07/25/2011 12:06:39 AM PDT
Updated: 07/25/2011 09:23:30 AM PDT


»WASHINGTON—Democratic and Republican congressional leaders shopped competing debt-crisis solutions and President Barack Obama canceled fundraising appearances Monday, as a politically gridlocked capital lurched into a climactic last full week before the Aug. 2 default deadline.

Even amid acknowledgments by U.S. leaders of the need to reassure jittery investors, world markets slipped and both the Dow Jones and Standard & Poor's 500 were down in early trading on Wall Street with the Aug. 2 deadline to raise the government's borrowing limit fast approaching.

House Speaker John Boehner and Senate Democratic Leader Harry Reid planned to unveil separate deficit reduction plans with their respective House and Senate caucuses after the Obama White House and Congress made little apparent headway in private talks over a long, steamy weekend.

Boehner was set to meet with his chamber's Republicans to discuss the GOP's clash with Obama over extending the government's borrowing authority. The Ohio Republican planned to unveil a new debt ceiling plan at the GOP meeting and post it online later in the day, a spokesman said.

Aides said Boehner's plan was a two-step process, with an immediate $1.2 trillion in cuts and spending caps coupled with a $900 billion debt ceiling increase, followed by creation of a congressional committee charged with producing nearly $2 trillion in additional cuts. The debt ceiling needs to be increased by about $2.4 trillion to last until 2013, the time frame that Obama and Democrats are insisting on, but which would not be immediately permitted under Boehner's plan.

Instead a second increase in the debt limit would have to be voted on next year, conditioned on congressional approval of the additional cuts.

GOP officials said Democrat Reid warmed to the idea in private talks on Sunday.

But after meeting with Obama Sunday evening, Reid instead called Boehner's proposal "a nonstarter in the Senate and with the president" because it would permit only a short-term increase of the sort that has already been rejected by Democrats. Boehner's office rejected that description.

Reid, D-Nev., said Sunday that Boehner's proposal "would not provide the certainty the markets are looking for and risks many of the same dire economic consequences that would be triggered by default itself."

Instead, Reid plans Monday to unveil his own new $2.7 trillion package of spending cuts that would also push the government's borrowing authority through next year, a timeline that Obama and top Democrats are demanding. It would do so without any new revenues, Reid said, thus meeting GOP demands for no new taxes, and Pelosi said Reid's plan also avoided touching Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security.

But Reid's plan was already being privately rejected by Republicans concerned that the cuts it contains would prove illusory, particularly $1 trillion or so in savings claimed by troop cuts in Iraq and Afghanistan over the coming decade. Reid counters that House Republicans claimed the same savings windfall when they passed their budget earlier this year.

Sen. Chuck Schumer, the No. 3 Democrat in the Senate leadership, said Monday one difficult reality is that no debt-crisis solution can be successful unless it has the support of five top players: Obama, Boehner, Reid, Pelosi and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell. But Schumer also said he thought Reid's proposal had the best chance of succeeding.

The competing plans were emerging after debt talks between Obama and Boehner on an ambitious $4 trillion package of spending cuts and revenue increases—the so-called "grand bargain"—collapsed spectacularly when Boehner walked out Friday. The speaker at the time accused Obama of moving the goalposts with demands for more taxes. The White House disputed that, but the focus of the talks has now largely moved from the White House to Capitol Hill.

The drama seemed certain to play out in nail-biting fashion, and it consumed Washington, as Obama canceled planned appearances at two Democratic fundraisers Monday night in Washington. He has barely ventured from the White House all month, and additional fundraising trips have also been canceled or postponed.

If the government's authority to borrow money isn't renewed by Aug. 2—its current $14.3 trillion limit having been reached—it won't have cash to pay all its bills. The administration and many others say that scenario would risk a first-ever federal default, with higher interest rates and other devastating effects cascading through the entire economy.

Both Boehner and Reid were hoping that by presenting their competing plans, they would demonstrate a seriousness that could prevent the world's financial markets from panicking and punishing the U.S. by demanding higher interest rates for the huge amounts of cash it must constantly borrow. Speaking to the U.S. Chamber of Commerce in Hong Kong early Monday, Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton tried to reassure financial markets that America's economy is sound and that a deal on the debt limit would be reached.

In a conference call with his colleagues on Sunday, Boehner said that his new plan "is gonna require some of you to make some sacrifices."

"If we stand together as a team, our leverage is maximized, and they have to deal with us. If we're divided, our leverage gets minimized," Boehner said, according to excerpts the speaker's office distributed to Republican offices.

"I would prefer to have a bipartisan approach to solve this problem," Boehner said on Fox News Sunday. "If that is not possible, I and my Republican colleagues in the House are prepared to move on our own."

Administration officials took to the airwaves on Sunday to make their case, with White House chief of staff William Daley saying Obama would veto a bill that didn't extend the borrowing limit into 2013.

"The president believes that we must get this uncertainty in order, to help the American economy and help the American people," Daley said on NBC's "Meet the Press."

Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner also underscored administration opposition to a short-term extension of the debt ceiling. Reaching out to investors, he said on CNN's "State of the Union" that a U.S. default was unthinkable, saying, "We never do that. It's not going to happen."

Schumer was interviewed Monday on MSBNC.

———

Associated Press writers David Espo, Ben Feller and Erica Werner contributed to this report.

http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_18543818

[Jon Miller]

How about making it short term but adding some taxes?

JM

[The Mad Monk]

Not even Reid is talking taxes now.

[Guynemer]

Which is ****ing insane.

[Hauldren Collider]

Republicans are REALLY good at chicken

[Kitschum]

IMHO Obama should just call it quits, pack up, and go home. Close the door on the whole rotten structure.

(Ex-)Americans, you shouldn't feel bad by all means. You've had a good run: 235 years is pretty damn decent for any republic-turned-empire, but now it's high time to move on to greener pastures! Start all over again. Make a new nation, without all the inherent evil and badness.

...Why not try a monarchy this time?