I have survived my second annual thinning of the herd

[KrazyHorse]

Are you always this much of an idiot?

http://tinyurl.com/4rk3ptg

[KrazyHorse]

Seriously, anybody who thinks that posting a single econometric study of something like the elasticity of demand for minimum wage workers proves anything is either naive or disingenuous.

[KrazyHorse]

If you want to seriously get a good overview of the relevant work, try to find a review paper. If you want to cherry-pick whatever studies you can find which demonstrate low elasticities of demand, go right ahead....

[C0ckney]

you dans'd me. saying that something is obvious and then being unable to provide any proof seems pretty weak to me. i'm actually interested in this and thought that people on the other side would have some good evidence. if you want to point me in the direction of a good review paper i'd be happy to read it.

as i understand it there are other studies which say the same thing. i did a search for UK data, because it's the labour market i know most about. found two which said no impact and a number of other studies which use their work. i have found a paper which summarises the work of other from 2009 which says that the effects on employment have been 'benign'. it quotes the study which makes precisely this point but, frustratingly, i can't find it on-line.

there also seems to be some good evidence that the minimum has had a positive effect on wage inequality.

But the UK has seen a remarkable fall in wage inequality at the bottom end of the wage distribution in recent years. The gap between the median and the tenth percentile of the hourly wage distribution fell by about 8 log points in the ten years after 1997, reversing the rise in inequality seen in the decade prior to 1997 (though not undoing the increase since 1979).

from what i've read it seems that the overall impact of the minimum wage in the UK has been a positive one and this has strong academic support. the low paid have gained significantly from it with it seems, few adverse effects on business. the people and politicians of all stripes now support it.

[Al B. Sure!]

If you believe you're better off than me then I don't see any reason why there should be transfer payments from me to you in order for you to fulfill your dreams of accomplishing what no osteoporotic ever has before....

Forgot to respond to this...

See this is exactly where your mental/emotional limitations lie.

Aeson was not talking about economic/financial well-being. See, KH, economic well-being is just one facet of human well-being and frankly, above the level of reasonable comfort, is superfluous. No, Aeson was referring to other areas of fulfillment.

Man doth not live by bread alone.

[KrazyHorse]

You're a ****ing idiot, albie. The WHOLE POINT of that post was to go beyond a fiscal definition of well-being. If, in this broad definition, you are better off than me, then under most theories of redistributive justice some of the current transfer from me to you should be undone...

[Al B. Sure!]

You're a ****ing idiot, albie. The WHOLE POINT of that post was to go beyond a fiscal definition of well-being. If, in this broad definition, you are better off than me, then under most theories of redistributive justice some of the current transfer from me to you should be undone...

A few things...

1) I'm not 'better off' than you yet because I have not yet fulfilled my goals
2) If one were fulfilled spiritually and in any other capacity but had no food... would you demand payment because he has greater well-being in other areas than you even though he is starving?
3) Only you would see military training as serving a redistributive function

[DaShi]

It didn't happen before. I've also developed this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oral_allergy_syndrome recently. I wonder if the two are related.

EDIT: I can't eat fresh carrots, celery, bell peppers, or raw nuts any more without feeling like my mouth is on fire and getting very nauseous. It really sucks.

This is all a natural response to working at GS. It's the result of your soul slowly withering away. In time, you won't even miss those foods.

[notyoueither]

Garlic and pure water will undoubtedly become problematic as well.

[KrazyHorse]

It's the result of your soul slowly withering away. In time, you won't even miss those foods.

I have developed a strange lust for baby flesh.

[RGBVideo]

evidence of jobs actually being destroyed by the introduction of a minmum wage?

The other way around, the higher the required wage is the less new jobs are being created by those who hold capital. This is not a "bad thing" or a "good thing" per se, either, as very low wage floor discourages technological applications (and their R&D) which would reduce amount of human work required for a completed product [e.g. there's a consensus that Roman manufacturing technology never got off the ground because they had slavery (near-zero cost of human production) in effect; no sense in inventing steam-powered machines when you have an unlimited supply of zero-waged labour to do the work with their own hands]. Artificially creating a very high wage floor (imagine if the UK government one day decided that the minimum wage would be £100 per hour and you get the idea) discourages hiring people and creates a permanent unproductive class of people who will eventually turn to black market (in modern day this would be stuff like drug and weapons trade -- think US' ghettos) in search of jobs.

that people on the other side would have some good evidence

Seriously though, what's with the surge of lefty-populist academic bias in the UK? First Drogue (an economics major from Oxford, no less) starts pushing the retarded 'speaking of economics, CEO wages/bonuses are an important issue and they should be somehow managed by the government' talking point straight out of Time magazine and now this. Do profs in your universities actually spoon-feed this stuff to you?

[RGBVideo]

True, skilled/educated people isn't hit by minimum wages, fine - forget them they are cared for. Those that would benefit from a minimum wage will need less medic care, less social sec., have lower criminality and more improtantly buy more.

Forcing employers to pay more than they receive in profit for the amount of work done results only in the firing of the employee by the employer and a wage of zero combined with unemployment, nothing more.

Why not hand them free money through the government if the main thing is to get them to "buy more"?

[N35t0r]

Okay, BlackCat, you're stupid. Companies can afford minimum wages, just like you can afford to pay an extra 100 dollars for a car. But you can't buy as much now that you've spent that extra 100 bucks, can you? THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY COST.

90%of the time, the opportunity cost is extra profit for owners.

[self biased]

That's not legal here. It's probably not legal there either, unless you're in an at-will state?

many states are 'at will employers' but depending on the actual job and why I was let go, I got severance pay. When they closed the film processing plant I worked for I got two months of free pay, plus about a month's worth of wages between severance and saved vacation time. I seem to recall that this was required by law because of how many people were being laid off at once and that they were shutting the facility down, not just me personally getting let go.

now, when i was fired from the one restaurant, the sous chef just came around at the end of the dinner rush and told me to get the f out.

[giblets]

You misunderstand "guaranteed minimum income". It is not a minimum wage; it is a direct payment from the government to each citizen. Think of it like that payment each Alaskan gets every year, paid out of the special tax on oil companies.

I like how a Republican dominated state does something socialistic.