Will Supreme Court take case on Obama's citizenship?

[Boris Godunov]

Another easy way to debunk this would be his mother's passport records. IIRC, she didn't leave the country for the first time in her life until after Obama was born. If there's no record of her traveling to Kenya around the time of his birth, then there's no reason to believe he was born anywhere but Hawaii.

[Darius871]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Defence in depth, even on such easily winnable cases.

Originally posted by Zkribbler
This is standard defense tactics: Raise every argument possible, and raise procedural arguments before substantive arguments.

If counsel goes directly to arguing the merits of the case, the court is almost certainly going to say he has waived the procedural arguments.

Oh I fully understand that it's good strategy; I just find it fairly irresponsible to set such a bad precedent in the long term:

If a voter doesn't have "standing" to question the constitutional eligibility of the options they have for a governmental office, who does have standing other than the government itself, which may have a conflict of interest? Doesn't that seem paradoxical (if not downright dangerous) to anyone? What happens when citizens have no standing to raise the question, and the FEC is too sidetracked or downright incompetent to do so (if not deliberately sitting on its hands)? In that instance the Clause itself would be rendered nugatory, and any first-year law student would tell you that an effectively nullifying interpretation is always disfavored.

Considering the dangerous implications of paradoxes like that, it's actually not the least bit surprising that the USSC will review the petition seriously with regard to standing (regardless of the merits). In fact if they happen to get into an unusually originalist mood this interlocutory ruling just might get overturned, or at the very least affirmed with different grounds to clarify for posterity. Not that that matters as far as Obama is concerned, since he can win on the merits with one hand tied behind his back anyway.

[TCO]

If he was Kenyan, it woujld be funny as hell to watch the media try to run from not having found it out. Of course it is just a nutter fantasy...but nutters can dream...

[Boris Godunov]

Yes, TCO, yes you can dream.

[TCO]

I'm jizzing over it. Would be more fun than a divided NCAA football title. Fvck the BCS.

[Deity Dude]

Originally posted by Comrade Snuggles
Even if he was born in Kenya, he is a natural born citizen of the United States, because his mother is a citizen.

According to Wikipedia:

Persons born in the United States, and persons born on foreign soil to two U.S. parents, are born American citizens and are classified as citizens at birth under 8 U.S.C. § 1401

[TCO]

Last seen Makeo?

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by TCO
I'm jizzing over it. Would be more fun than a divided NCAA football title. Fvck the BCS.

Obama says he wants to fix this NCAA so there are playoffs. Better hope he stays.

[Darius871]

Originally posted by TCO
I just find it incredible to think that were he, he thought he could get away with it.

Why wouldn't he get away with it? Seriously, even supposing hypothetically that it is 100% true and is proven to be, what would the consequences be?

Say for instance that this is remanded for litigation on the factual merits, which would take several months at least, and ultimately documents from discovery prove that A) he was born in Kenya with a local certificate to prove it, B) he naturalized himself in Indonesia in order to obtain an Indonesian passport for passage into Pakistan, C) the certificate from which the JPEG was scanned is a photoshop with no official seal printed on ordinary paper carbon-tested to be only two years old, D) his entries in the Hawaii Department of Health computer database are proven by forensic experts to have been added to the relevant hard drives in 2007 illegitimately, and E) the person from the Hawaii Department of Health who claims to have seen the original with her own eyes breaks down in a deposition to admit she made up the story for a $40,000 bribe from George Soros.

Suppose all this comes out in the litigation, and there is a finding of fact that he is not a U.S. citizen. Then suppose the Supreme Court unanimously rules that this finding of fact renders his presidency illegitimate.

What would happen next? By that time, Obama would already be the sitting President, probably with a great deal of passed legislation and a few international crises under his belt. He could resign and let Joe Biden take his desk, but would that even be enough when the election wouldn't necessarily have gone how it did had Obama not been the candidate? Would the Electoral College reconvene, and pick an alternate Democrat? How would the electors' votes be legitimate when the voters chose Obama in particular, not any generic Democrat? Would there have to be a special election?

Even more interesting - suppose Obama, an avid student of history, pulls an Andrew Jackson and tells the Supreme Court "yeah nice ruling there, now let's see you enforce it!" Since he's supposedly such a deeply inspiring and transformational figure, maybe half of the country would think that the popular vote and his huge electoral college victory would trump this minor "technicality" of archaically xenophobic origin, and support his staying in office. WTF happens then? Civil War II?

Ok, now I'm jizzing too, thanks TCO...

[Zkribbler]

Originally posted by TCO
That would be a glorious kerfuffle if he really was Kenyan. I just find it incredible to think that were he, he thought he could get away with it. Probably more likely that his religion was listed as Muslim and he's embarressed.

Why would his religion be listed as Muslim? His dad was an atheist, and his mom was an agnostic.

[Timexwatch]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov


They more or less did. An authority in Hawaii went and saw the certificate and verified it was there and authentic. He probably couldn't show it for privacy reasons.

At any rate, the Obama campaign released a scan of the actual certificate, and it's easily found on the web.

I've seen the scanned copy. It's just that it would be easy to film it being brought out and shown then put back. They can easily blur the sensitive parts.

[Darius871]

Obviously that "authority" is just a kool-aid-drinking true believer, or bribed, or both. It's the only explanation that makes sense.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Zkribbler
Why would his religion be listed as Muslim? His dad was an atheist, and his mom was an agnostic.

IIRC, as a child Obama's religion was listed as Islam on his documents at the school in Indonesia. However, this was because his uncle had enrolled him and they used his uncle's religion. The school itself was not religious in nature, either.

[TCO]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov


Obama says he wants to fix this NCAA so there are playoffs. Better hope he stays.

I prefer dispute.

[TCO]

Darius: Biden would succeed. It wojuld be similar to a death or incapacitation or resignation. Provided Obama already serving. Obama would not be able to stop the enforcement of sucvh a ruling. The popular opinion would not sustain him and the military would have more allegiance to the Constitution than the man.