Obama and Israel

[Lancer]

Obama says he's tight with the jews, but I have my doubts. The arabs sure love Obama for some reason. So Israel has got to figure it might face difficult times ahead, and face them alone.

So you're the Isreali ambassador, and you bring these problems to president Bush. The last friend you might see in the oval office is on his way out. You've got a shopping list, so what do you ask for? What do you want to bring with you to the plains of armageddon to fight your war of national survival if Uncle Sam is sitting on the sidelines?

I ask for some F-22 Raptors, M-1 Abrams tanks, bunker buster bombs, whatever the ultra modern air defense is, and some...and this is the tough one...stealth fighters and even tougher...a stealth bomber that I can load my nukes into.

Bush would likely go wide eyed, but he sees the writing on the wall if not Cheney can explain it to him. Congress has to approve such so it might get a bit dicey but there are ways, illegal ways.

Btw, if Obama really doesn't support Israel, then the arabs attack, period.

[SlowwHand]

I'd give them stealth. We can trump that already, I believe.

[Lancer]

I'd give them stuff we can't yet trump. It has to be modern for possibly the next 8 years so it has to be cutting edge today.

[SlowwHand]

You think someone else is about to have stealth?

[Lancer]

Strealth is out there. Just need to put up the bucks. Even the eurofighter is supposed to be a tad stealthy. Would have been fully stealth if they had gotten their euro selves to agree to pay to defend themselves for once, but not much chance of that.

[Aeson]

We arm just about everyone in the middle east. It's part of the problem, not the solution.

[Lancer]

You might be right about that Aeson, but maybe there's still a bit of method to the geopolitical madness.

[onodera]

A stealth bomber won't save Israel. It'll be shot down during the takeoff.
Abramses won't save Israel. Their tanks are better, but Hezbollah still thrashed them.
F-22's won't save them either. Who needs fighters when your enemy won't use aircraft much?
What will save Israel is American military bases in every vulnerable spot. No one is afraid of attacking Israel now, but attacking the US is a different thing.
If this isn't done and Obama ignores the Jewish lobby or fights it as any special interest group he promised he would, then Israel is toast.

[Lancer]

You can't really tell if a stealth bomber is in the air or on the ground until you get eyes on. That makes it an effective deterrent. The Abrams is a good tank. Not invulnerable as it once was but still the best. Air superiority is a major factor, the arabs will use airpower. Israel definately will. F-22s would give Isreal a tremendous edge.

All this stuff hopefully would either stop the arabs from attacking or help the Israelis beat them without US help.

The US bases aren't going to happen.

"If this isn't done and Obama ignores the Jewish lobby or fights it as any special interest group he promised he would, then Israel is toast."

Another jewish holocaust is what I would be hoping to avoid by giving Israel weapons before Obama takes power.

[LotC]

Anyone in Washington that doesn't unconditionally support Israel is politically dead. Obama knows this; that's why the first thing he did after securing the nomination was to go swear fealty to AIPAC.

[Lancer]

I didn't see that on the news LotC. Where do you get it from?

[Heresson]

No it isn't. Who is gonna attack Israel?
Egypt - no it wont, because
- it would loose USA's financial support
- it will lose tourism benefits
- it has a peace treaty, so its reputation would be damaged

Jordan - don't make me laugh

Lebanon - only Hizb Allah would want it. But while it can successfully defend its strongholds, but it can hardly attack except for missle activity, and ah shiites it will not get popular support in Palestine, Constant anti-israeli rambling gives it domestic support, but it is too weak to fight Israel on its own ground.

Syria - it is too weak to do it alone, it's army is a mess, it does not have strong economy, and its citizens do not want war.

Iraq - too weak, divided, helpless.

Iran - too far away

Palestinians - not able to do anything alone.

Israel is way ahead of anyone, even if they teamed up and really wanted to attack.
It is completely safe, and talk about how endangered it is, is only a way to get more money from american taxpayer's pocket.

[Lancer]

I guess we'll see, won't we Heresson? Nothing we say here is going to effect anything anyway, so we'll see how it plays out.

[Riesstiu IV]

Jesus Christ, when did Israel become the 51st state? Why does every politician have to promise monetary and military support. You could probably solve a lot of anti-American hatred among the camel jockeys by not taking a strong stance on the Israel/Palestine issues like Japan does. Having such a strong alliance with Israel doesn't do much for us and Israel has been a pretty questionable ally at times. Still not as bad as Saudi Arabia.

Frankly, I would prefer a presidential candidate who had the guts to not lick Israel's taint. Arabs aren't going to attack Israel just because Obama doesn't send a sh*t ton of weapons and a billion dollar check.

[Lancer]

I guess we'll see about that. Certainly its Iran's declared intention to attack Isreal. I guess what you have to ask yourself is what its worth to you to prevent the Iranians and arabs overrunning Israel and the resulting holocaust. If nothing, well then I guess that's your view.