Late Night Ponderings: Going for a MSc or MBA, is it worth it?

[Asher]

I'm debating going back to school for a MSc in CS or an MBA. I'm not sure which, or if it's worth it.

Since I've graduated (only a few years ago) with my BSc in CS, I've mostly been working with the investment banks. I've got tons of C++ and finserv experience, but right now that's not in high demand. In the meantime my company is doing lots of C# work, much of it on Microsoft Surface. It's kind of cool, but it's not really high-margin enough for my taste. The company may even be downsizing -- they haven't said it, but it's pretty obvious to me given how many of their clients were Wall Street banks who are now bankrupt or not going to doing more business lately, especially because we're not the cheapest of companies.

This, combined with the fact that I've been planning on moving back out west come April once the SO graduates from school...has got me thinking. Is it worth it go do a (non-course based) MSc in CompSci? How about an MBA? Money/income shouldn't be a problem, given that me going back to school will coincide with the SO making pretty good money in the oilpatch in Alberta, so we'd live...

It's a good time to consider school due to a January application deadline...but I may still end up working more anyway. Decisions, decisions...

[Kuciwalker]

Semi-OT: Check out Palantir Technologies. They do some really cool financial apps (and some intelligence stuff that's hard to describe, but really neat), and would probably like your credentials. They dropped by my OS practicum lecture the other day (after our career fair) and demoed their stuff for us.

(they also mentioned that they were hiring)

[Asher]

Thanks for the link, will check them out.

One of the strongest possibilities for me is to return to work for IBM. They opened a new Calgary software lab that focuses on grid computing and other kinds of HPC, something I've also got a little background in. And I've also worked for IBM before, so that should help...and I still know a ton of people there, though they're at the Toronto lab...

[Kuciwalker]

I might intern for IBM this summer. Just had a phone interview the other day for their "Extreme Blue" thing (3 CS 1 MBA work on a single problem for 3 months).

[notyoueither]

The funny letters are the currency of many jobs in places you'd be well suited to do, and well rewarded for doing.

I have no idea which is better between an MSc or MBA.

[Asher]

Extreme Blue is a terrific program. When I was there, some US Extreme Blue teams even came by the Toronto lab to demo it, they go to do some globetrotting...

[Asher]

Originally posted by notyoueither
The funny letters are the currency of many jobs in places you'd be well suited to do, and well rewarded for doing.

I have no idea which is better between an MSc or MBA.

I suppose MSc/MBA will be a bigger question about which direction do I want to head in. Do I want to stay tech-oriented, or do I want to head into the realm of pointy-haired bosses...

[Jon Miller]

My observation is that a MSc is worth about 1-2 years experience while a PhD is worth 3-5 years experience. There are of course extra doors opened, glass ceilings which no longer exist/etc.

I don't know about the MBA. I would guess that unless you feel the need to retool, the MBA would be a better option than the MSc.

I haven't spent all that much time looking for work, and I have a physics degree and not a computer science degree.

JM

[Pekka]

I think it's more clear cut in favour of MBA. M.Sc. is nice and all, but what it is is basically just bunch of new courses on top of that B.Sc. and that thesis work. That's all it is. I don't think it will give you much interesting information or spark your creative side anymore. Few years ago, who knows, now, I don't know.

MBA on the other hand is different. It's such a different acronym. It assumes more hands on type of action while doing it. That, and gives you more of the business perspective, which shouldn't be undermined by tech guys these days. It simply gives you much more diversity, and when you're in a position where they look for people into management, MBA can't hurt, but M.Sc. won't give you much edge. So as a positionining acronym, MBA would be better. As experience, MBA would be better. ANd of course with value in our world, MBA gives you more.

In my mind M.Sc. is overrated. It doesn't really get much into research, doing research and you can see it in peoples thesis'. 99% have no idea what they're doing, nor were they able to formulate their way of doing things on their own or with help. Most oyu see is some project, possibly and at most a survey with no real analysis. For a tech guy it doesn't matter much anyway, but hte point is, if you are a tech guy, what is M.Sc. going to offer? Few more courses on things that you already likely know.

I think you have much more to gain with MBA as far as knowledge goes as well. You're a good tech guy already, so how about branching out, get that business lingo inside of you while you're at it? It can't hurt. M.Sc., however, might turn out ot be waste of time for you. Unless you're going for PhD, I don't see why you would take this route.

You're a tech guy, where my background is also. So I know you look at the things yourself, you learn by yourself, you don't need few courses to confirm what you already have experience on, which most likely is also irrelevant at times and doesn't work in real life.

I mean... even we do MBAs here, consesus is that for exampel information security is not just an "enabler of processes", which is sort of self justifying mantra to keep your job, but to compete with business units, to do battle of the budgets, to give value, to maximize and promote value growth to stakeholders. Most actual calculations we do is business these days anyway. It's a different field, but the point is, business knowledge is always going to give you POVs you can use that others don't have. And ultimately it will give you much more credible acronym if you want to change your train at some point. M.Sc. won't give you much value in the long run because you're already a professional and you have established yourself, and since you're not going into research and doctorate studies, I don't see the point versus MBA.

[Jon Miller]

If the market isn't as good as he would like for his expertise, retooling in the education system for a year or two might be a good idea. Particularly if your future career path is likely to run into a ceiling without the MSc. Far better to retool when you aren't in as much demand than when you are in a lot of demand.

JM

[Kidlicious]

Please get an MBA so that you will atleast know something about business.

[rah]

If you weren't in a technical field I'd highly recommend a MBA. While I doubt that an MBA wouldn't do some good, I don't think it would be worth the investment. In all my years I've never seen not having one being a limiting factor in the computer technical industry. Technical people that have management skills are rare enough that they don't need anything to distinguish themselves from the masses, unlike other fields. They rise to the top automatically.

Now those skills could be useful if you were running a startup company, but then you'd be trying to impress investors and not bosses.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
My observation is that a MSc is worth about 1-2 years experience while a PhD is worth 3-5 years experience. There are of course extra doors opened, glass ceilings which no longer exist/etc.

But how much time do you spend doing them? A MSc is about 2 years, so if it's equivalent to about 1-2 years of experience that's a losing proposition...I don't think I'd do a PhD, I hate academia too much for that.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Pekka
I think it's more clear cut in favour of MBA. M.Sc. is nice and all, but what it is is basically just bunch of new courses on top of that B.Sc. and that thesis work. That's all it is. I don't think it will give you much interesting information or spark your creative side anymore. Few years ago, who knows, now, I don't know.

Actually one of the things I'd considered that maybe MSc would spark my creative side. The past few years I've been doing trading systems which doesn't really lend itself well to creativity -- in most cases the solutions are clear-cut and proven.

With a thesis-driven Masters I was hoping to maybe blaze a new trail of some kind. Maybe in AI or machine learning, maybe in computer graphics, etc. One of the reasons I strongly considered the Masters is I've got so many people close to me in grad school right now that it's kind of funny -- my brother is doing a Masters in mechanical engineering (on his way to a PhD), my best friend went back to school for her MSc in CS and is about halfway done, and another close friend is doing a Masters in computer engineering. They're all doing things I find to be pretty interesting and usually different from what you'd get in the working world: my brother is experimenting with FIRE and new fire retardant systems, my best friend is writing geospatial algorithms for databases, and my friend is trying some new ideas for ASIC debugging.

MBA on the other hand is different. It's such a different acronym. It assumes more hands on type of action while doing it. That, and gives you more of the business perspective, which shouldn't be undermined by tech guys these days. It simply gives you much more diversity, and when you're in a position where they look for people into management, MBA can't hurt, but M.Sc. won't give you much edge. So as a positionining acronym, MBA would be better. As experience, MBA would be better. ANd of course with value in our world, MBA gives you more.

That's the other thing, the MBA can be useful in perhaps accelerating a career in some kind of management. I don't believe they're required, but they do perhaps jumpstart that aspect.

In my mind M.Sc. is overrated. It doesn't really get much into research, doing research and you can see it in peoples thesis'. 99% have no idea what they're doing, nor were they able to formulate their way of doing things on their own or with help. Most oyu see is some project, possibly and at most a survey with no real analysis. For a tech guy it doesn't matter much anyway, but hte point is, if you are a tech guy, what is M.Sc. going to offer? Few more courses on things that you already likely know.

I think you have much more to gain with MBA as far as knowledge goes as well. You're a good tech guy already, so how about branching out, get that business lingo inside of you while you're at it? It can't hurt. M.Sc., however, might turn out ot be waste of time for you. Unless you're going for PhD, I don't see why you would take this route.

You're a tech guy, where my background is also. So I know you look at the things yourself, you learn by yourself, you don't need few courses to confirm what you already have experience on, which most likely is also irrelevant at times and doesn't work in real life.

I mean... even we do MBAs here, consesus is that for exampel information security is not just an "enabler of processes", which is sort of self justifying mantra to keep your job, but to compete with business units, to do battle of the budgets, to give value, to maximize and promote value growth to stakeholders. Most actual calculations we do is business these days anyway. It's a different field, but the point is, business knowledge is always going to give you POVs you can use that others don't have. And ultimately it will give you much more credible acronym if you want to change your train at some point. M.Sc. won't give you much value in the long run because you're already a professional and you have established yourself, and since you're not going into research and doctorate studies, I don't see the point versus MBA.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Kidicious
Please get an MBA so that you will atleast know something about business.

I'm pretty sure I know far more about it than you do. Your understanding of basic economics is pretty amazing.