You are the Mayor of Sao Paolo. How Would You Stop Crime?

[Barnabas]

Fine.
It is one of the biggest economies in the world, and they are doing very well. Sao Paulo is one the worlds most important industrial areas.
The Economist has been kissing Brazil´s ass for the last few years, and recently they have discovered huge oil fields.

Anyway, those ideas can´t be applied, even if they have all that money, because those ideas are extremely right wing.

You can´t forcefully castrate people.

You can´t take kids aways from their mothers to put them in state owned boarding schools (even if the kid has killed people and his family is a mess)

Demolishing shanty towns is a pain in the ass.


In Argentina, what they did with many shanty towns in the 70´s, was to build huge tower blocks complexes in the buenos aires suburbs and move the poor there.

The tower blocks were not actually bad, they were like those eastern european buildings.
This is one in Villa Lugano for example




The issue is that at the end, they end up becoming "skycraper shanty towns", to keep a building in shape, the people there have to pay, otherwise, the pipes or elevator eventually wil get broken, but the shanty town iinhabitants recently moved there, don´t do that because they are poor. And they keep having kids and you eventually have a family of 7 living in an apartment with only two bedrooms.

That is why moving them to towerblocks ain´t good.

In the shanty towns, if they need an extra room, they build another one over the roof, like this

[VetLegion]

Did moving the poor people to apartment buildings in Argentina help with the crime?

Also was this done during the military dictatorship?

[Wezil]

Originally posted by Barnabas
Fine.
It is one of the biggest economies in the world, and they are doing very well. Sao Paulo is one the worlds most important industrial areas.

The Economist has been kissing Brazil´s ass for the last few years, and recently they have discovered huge oil fields.

Then WTF are they spending their money on if shanty towns are this big a problem?

You can´t forcefully castrate people.

Yeah, that would be a tough one.

You can´t take kids aways from their mothers to put them in state owned boarding schools (even if the kid has killed people and his family is a mess)

Yes you can. Especially if they have killed people and his family is a mess.

Demolishing shanty towns is a pain in the ass.

So inconvenience should prevent it from happening?

In Argentina, what they did with many shanty towns in the 70´s, was to build huge tower blocks complexes in the buenos aires suburbs and move the poor there.

The tower blocks were not actually bad, they were like those eastern european buildings.
This is one in Villa Lugano for example

Better than shanty towns, but again would require some government $$.

The issue is that at the end, they end up becoming "skycraper shanty towns", to keep a building in shape, the people there have to pay, otherwise, the pipes or elevator eventually wil get broken, but the shanty town iinhabitants recently moved there, don´t do that because they are poor. And they keep having kids and you eventually have a family of 7 living in an apartment with only two bedrooms.

Because of course the government $$ stops and things fall apart. Money does seem to be at the root of the problem after all.

Overcrowding goes back to gov regulation but I don't imagine we'll agree on the extent of this if you believe removing killer children from homes is "extreme right wing".

That is why moving them to towerblocks ain´t good.

If the only positive action taken is to reloctae people then it will not solve the underlying problems. Apartment blocks however are still better than shanty towns.

In the shanty towns, if they need an extra room, they build another one over the roof, like this

Exactly, a disaster waiting to happen on so many fronts.

[/QUOTE]

[Barnabas]

Yes, I wanted to mention something related to that,

Even tough Argentina was ruled by a murderous dictatorship from 76 to 83, very right wing. Not even them managed to destroy all the shanty towns. It is very difficult.

The last picture is from an Argentine shanty town in Buenos Aires. It is the most famous one of Argentina. Villa 31 in the Neighbourhood of Retiro. A very wealthy neighbourhood. Many Argentines wish they could get rid of that shanty town, (many wealthy people too, because that land is extremely expensive) but they always tell themselves, if the military dictators couldn´t get rid of it. In democracy it is impossible.

It didn´t really help against insecurity. Argentina was a very safe country back then. It is still a quite safe country (more than the USA for example)
It was done more for aesthetic reasons. And because urbanists thought it was a good thing to do. Those tower blocks were built with elevated platforms connecting all the buildings, people back them would look at the buildings, and say, that´s cool, like from The Jetsons.
Argentina was the whole first half of the XX century one of the wealthies countries on earth, and as late as the 70´s its decadence was not that obvious (in fact, that dictatorship did much to ruin Argentina), it still looked like a semi-first world country. For example, It was only in the late 70 and 80´s that Spain, Portugal, Greece or South Korea passed Argentina in gdp per capita.

Most violence back then was political, not poverty related.

Now, violence is poverty related, and shanty towns became a serious problem after the 2001-2002 economic crisis. 1/15 of the population of Buenos Aires live in shanty towns nowadays. from 40 to 60% depending on the shanty town are immigrants from Paraguay, Bolivia and Peru or sons of them.

[Barnabas]

By the way. I have a maid who lives in a shanty town the two days she does not work for me.

[VetLegion]

You have a maid?!

Get out of my thread

[Krill]

Kill everyone and let god sort them out.

[Heraclitus]

You are the Mayor of Sao Paolo. How Would You Stop Crime?

The solution:

[Heraclitus]

Originally posted by VetLegion
You have a maid?!

Get out of my thread

Oh he must be either one of those rich envious people who are really of poor descent or a virtous rich person who will marry a poor girl because he loves her.

And all the chicks in his life are hot.


How many episode has you show reached so far B?

[Provost Harrison]

My colleague is from Sao Paolo. No relevance to this thread, just thought I'd mention it

[Barnabas]

Originally posted by Heraclitus


Oh he must be either one of those rich envious people who are really of poor descent or a virtous rich person who will marry a poor girl because he loves her.

And all the chicks in his life are hot.


How many episode has you show reached so far B?

She just takes care of my paraplegic grandmother, altough I make her wash my clothes too.

By the way, last friday her "house" and a lot of other houses burned down. That happens Relatively often because in shanty towns all the electricity connections are illegal, and short circuits and other accidents are common.
She was quite sad and nervous, she lost her tv. She did not come for three days because she had to wait for the municipality to give her a new place + matresses + metal plates for roofs etc etc

[Heraclitus]

Originally posted by Barnabas


She just takes care of my paraplegic grandmother, altough I make her wash my clothes too.

By the way, last friday her "house" and a lot of other houses burned down. That happens Relatively often because in shanty towns all the electricity connections are illegal, and short circuits and other accidents are common.
She was quite sad and nervous, she lost her tv. She did not come for three days because she had to wait for the municipality to give her a new place + matresses + metal plates for roofs etc etc

What a sad story.

Has your grandmothemr made her will? If she hasn't you should really keep an eye on your "best friend" who dosen't like poor people and treats the poor beautifull but simple and good at heart maid with disrespect.

[VetLegion]

Too many Latin-American soap operas Heraclitus?

[Heraclitus]

Originally posted by VetLegion


Too many Latin-American soap operas Heraclitus?

What else is there to know about Latin-America?