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WTF is wrong with Rev. Wright?

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  • #76
    Originally posted by Arrian


    As for the last bit - claiming to speak for "the Black Church" ... I rather doubt he is quite that influential. If he is, it's both sad and alarming.
    He doesn't, United Church of Christ doesn't even register as one of the main "Black churches". So whether other "Black Churches" share his views may or may not be but Wright has no reason to say he represents Black Churches other than the Chicago denomination. Further, he certainly doesn't even speak for UCC views. We are leftist to be sure but not that wacked.
    "Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson

    “In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy Carter

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    • #77
      Originally posted by DinoDoc
      Does "on some level" mean that he agrees with Wright that black Americans have generally gotten a raw deal and that US foreign policy has often been seriously ****ed up?
      I'm fairly certain that you can find a sane pastor expressing those views, Arrian. We're talking about a man that can not seem to help saying crazy ****. On some level in this case means agreeing with the type of sentiments expressed in the AIDS comment.
      Remember you're talking to an atheist. I wouldn't take my kids to church at all. I think it's all nutty.

      The AIDS comment is the most glaring one, to be sure. Did Obama "agree on some level" with that statement? I don't know.

      -Arrian
      grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

      The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

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      • #78
        Originally posted by PLATO
        At some point, I think we all want to know why Obama has been attending this church for twenty years. Okay...no guilt by association, but twenty years? Surely there is eithier more to Rev Wright than we know......or more to Obama than we know.
        I've been trying to fathom that one as well. My guess is that Obama fell in love with Michelle and wanted to set down roots with her in her neighborhood. The choice to attend this particular church probably resulted from her social or family ties to this congregation. I don't know so much that Obama was or was not trying to establish black street cred, or that he agreed with the obvioulsy racist and devisive messages other than it was a vehicle for him to minister social justice themes that resonated with him.

        Even were this the case, I doubt it would help Obama much as he can't throw his wife under the bus or look like a namby pamby whipped husband who does what his wife says simply because she told him to do something that he knows is inherently wrong.
        "Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson

        “In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy Carter

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        • #79
          And it wasn't just 20 years of ministry support. He called him his "mentor" and dedicated a book to him. Thats not your casual drinking buddy friend.
          "The DPRK is still in a state of war with the U.S. It's called a black out." - Che explaining why orbital nightime pictures of NK show few lights. Seriously.

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          • #80
            Of everything Wright has said, only the AIDS comment seems completely outrageous.

            And it's worth saying that this particular paranoia wasn't created in a vacuum, but is specifically due to past government actions. Namely, between '32 and '72, the government studied the effects of untreated syphilis among black men by pretending to treat them (note that penicilin was availabile in '47). That's why man-made creation of HIV/AIDS is a non-marginal point of view in the black community:
            Nearly half of the 500 African Americans surveyed said that HIV, the virus that causes AIDS, is man-made. The study, which was supported by the National Institute of Child Health and Human Development, appears in the Feb. 1 edition of the Journal of Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndromes.

            More than one-quarter said they believed that AIDS was produced in a government laboratory, and 12 percent believed it was created and spread by the CIA.

            http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A33695-2005Jan24.html


            It's also unlikely that expressing this idea was a recurring theme in his sermons.

            Not really. It seemed like a bunch of softballs to me.


            Clearly, Moyers should've asked him about the lack of a flag pin on his lapel.
            "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
            -Bokonon

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            • #81
              Incidentally, I'd like to ask some people here a question. Are the ideas expressed by Wright more harmful to human society than the idea that birth control is immoral (a belief held by many "mainstream" religious leaders)?
              "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
              -Bokonon

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              • #82
                Stawmen don't become you Ramo.
                I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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                • #83
                  Originally posted by Ramo
                  Of everything Wright has said, only the AIDS comment seems completely outrageous.
                  It's not that outrageous when you consider that the government did virtually nothing while so many people died.
                  I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
                  - Justice Brett Kavanaugh

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                  • #84
                    Dino, I thought you expressed approval of the ABC "debate."

                    The interview was good in providing insight and context. I'm not a fan of the Cult of Pumpkinhead school of journalism where the job is to specifically find controversial sound-bytes.
                    "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                    -Bokonon

                    Comment

                    • #85
                      The stupidest thing Obama did was become a christian. Christians are insane, and not just the black ones of course. Jerry Faldwell said that a hurricane attacked the US because of sin. Now how is that any different from what Wright said. What a black man can't believe in the old testament. I mean ****, if you believe that God punishes nations for sin the US ought to have been destoyed a long time ago with a million hurricanes and tornados. How insane is that?
                      I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
                      - Justice Brett Kavanaugh

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                      • #86
                        Outrageous to informed reason, Kid. As I said, the paranoia in the black community didn't arise out of a vacuum. But people who have a mind to figure out the likely origin of AIDS can. And it's disappointing that Wright didn't, because otherwise he seems like a pretty reasonable guy...
                        "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                        -Bokonon

                        Comment

                        • #87
                          Originally posted by Ramo
                          I'm not a fan of the Cult of Pumpkinhead school of journalism where the job is to specifically find controversial sound-bytes.
                          I'm not a fan of the school of journalism where the interviewer starts fawning all over the subject he's supposed to be reporting on acting more as thier press agent that as someone supposed to be searching for the truth.
                          I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                          For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

                          Comment

                          • #88
                            Originally posted by Ramo
                            Outrageous to informed reason, Kid. As I said, the paranoia in the black community didn't arise out of a vacuum. But people who have a mind to figure out the likely origin of AIDS can. And it's disappointing that Wright didn't, because otherwise he seems like a pretty reasonable guy...

                            He doesn't seem any more or less reasonable than anyone else who believes in the old testament. He does however, seem to understand more about American and how it works than a lot of people. He may be a paranoid but still, looking at how the rest of the nation is reacting to this, like the idiots that they are, makes him look like the most reasonable person in the world.
                            I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
                            - Justice Brett Kavanaugh

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                            • #89
                              I'm not a fan of the school of journalism where the interviewer starts fawning all over the subject he's supposed to be reporting on acting more as thier press agent that as someone supposed to be searching for the truth.


                              In the vast amount of news coverage so far, no context was given to Wright's remarks. Moyers allowed him to do that. I don't see why that's a bad thing. As I was saying, if you want an interesting conversation, instead of a series of gotcha questions, you might enjoy the interview.
                              "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                              -Bokonon

                              Comment

                              • #90
                                Originally posted by Ramo
                                As I was saying, if you want an interesting conversation, instead of a series of gotcha questions, you might enjoy the interview.
                                Why do you think Lou Dobbs is so much more popular than Bill Moyer?
                                I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
                                - Justice Brett Kavanaugh

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