I am inclined to Jew's version

[Pekka]

Just lijke I said, the most adaptable religion

[Pekka]

Well I guess I don't get Christianity. I thought this Jesus thing was important in it. Oh well what do I know, there are lots of interpretations out there...

[Elok]

I can never quite follow your manifestos, Pekka. Are you asking for a definite answer while simultaneously denying anyone's right to answer definitively?

[Pekka]

Elok, you can't have a defnitive answer when it comes to religion.

If you can't follow my "manifestos", please, don't participate then.

[Proteus_MST]

Hm, I think the most important thing in christianity is that he died at the cross for our sins and for this it is rather unimportant if he is god himself or just a pesonality that is "just" his son (and somehow also unimportant wether we talk to Jesus in our prayers or to god himelf)

[Pekka]

I'm nto even asking for answers. It would be futile, we don't have posters here, nor any theologians alive that can explain how holy trinity makes sense in the way that you have to accept Jesus.

But I can be fairly sure, that Christianity and Jesus, this is the very cornerstone of it all. If Jesus isn't the son of God the way it has been laid out, oh well, it does kind of pull the rug from it all.

[Pekka]

Proteus, exactly. Then Jesus isn't hte son of God anymore than we are.

[Pekka]

So so far the only arguments I've heard is that this Jesus thing being the son of God isn't actually the very key issue in Christianity? And that there are many interpretations of this so... OK, so even though the new testament is about Jesus, the symbol of the religion is cross and the name comes from it, it's not so important after all, rather semantics, subject to change and open to interpretation, but the rest is really where it's at?

Like I said, adaptable.

[Jon Miller]

Pekka, you posts were so full of statements which were ill-informed that I would have to write a book in order to engage in a discussion with you (or at least 5 or 7 long posts). There are lots of arguments, however, you aren't informed enough to be aware of them.

So what I am suggesting that you do is read some. Learn and inform yourself. Than maybe we can have a discussion.

JM

[Elok]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
(or at least 5 or 7 long posts).

Ohhhhh BK....

(as requested, I'm not participating directly since I find Pekka hard to follow, but I still hope to glean some clues on the discussion indirectly)

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Proteus_MST
Hm, I think the most important thing in christianity is that he died at the cross for our sins and for this it is rather unimportant if he is god himself or just a pesonality that is "just" his son (and somehow also unimportant wether we talk to Jesus in our prayers or to god himelf)

And God can't even die. I mean Christianity is just so manipulative.

[Impaler[WrG]]

I agree you should do some reading Peka, but I recomend Nietzsche, begin with the Genealogy of Morals (its short and to the point) then proceed to Beyond Good and Evil (elaborates thouse same points in depth) then try to cap it off with some scolarly interpritations I recomend Walter Kaufmann the formost translator and students of Nietzsche's works.

[Jon Miller]

I don't think that is talking about Christology.

JM

[Nikolai]

Pekka, the Jews still waits for the Messiah to come. The new testament tells us he already have come and have fullfilled the promises of the old testament. It tells us that this Messiah is Jesus Christ and that all people, Jews and Gentiles alike, can get salvation for free. All that is needed is to believe that Israel's God sent his Son to fix all our failings, that he died and rose again for us, and that he promises an eternal life better than we can imagine if we only accept his gift.

Romans 10.9:

That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

That is all. The rest is theology and human traditions.

[Elok]

Originally posted by Impaler[WrG]
I agree you should do some reading Peka, but I recomend Nietzsche, begin with the Genealogy of Morals (its short and to the point) then proceed to Beyond Good and Evil (elaborates thouse same points in depth) then try to cap it off with some scolarly interpritations I recomend Walter Kaufmann the formost translator and students of Nietzsche's works.

While you're at it, I recommend you turn to the works of Mao Tse-Tung the next time you're curious about Keynesian economics, Pekka.