A Question About Highschools in the USA

[VetLegion]

Originally posted by Pekka
ALSO, are kids expected to use public transportation. WTF?! HS kids aren't small children. What do you mean expected to use.... I just don't get this one at all.

Of course they use the public transportation. I used it for 4 years of my highschool (14-18). 14 year olds are competent enough to use it, and the city is safe enough for them to do so.

[Pekka]

Well why not wonder if they serve applie pie every thursday? Just curious, you know.

[Pekka]

VetLegion, come on, are you sure 14 year olds are really mature and skilled enough to use p-p-p-p-public transportation? What if they start licking the floor? Or what if some adult rapes them in the middle of the bus? Or what if they can't figure out how the thing works, that you need to get in and out?

[Lorizael]

Stupid question for other Americans: Am I completely ignorant in thinking that kids in U.S. cities ride school busses, too? Have I not traveled far enough outside of my suburban paradise?

[VetLegion]

Originally posted by rah
On top of public HS there are quite a few private schools. Most upper class large inner city students go to these over the public schools. Getting in to these require money, pull, and good grades.

So, you can choose your school only if it is a private school? If you want to attend a public school you are "doomed" to the one nearby?

How does this work with regards to students' affinities? Here highschools usually have a direction, they're not general. For example you have a highschool for car mechanics, hair dressers, nurses and gymnasiums which aren't teaching you anything specific but are better at preparing you for college.

I can't quite grasp the concept of someone in, say, New York being limited to only some of the schools within reach of 1 hour on the subway. It doesn't make sense.

[Dinner]

Local schools mostly get paid for by local property taxes so areas with high home prices end up getting more money. To my knowledge California is the only state who tries to even things out by having the state take all education funds and then redistributing them equally on a per student basis. Also many counties, like San Diego County where I live, have an open enrollment policy where parents can enroll their students in any school in the county though if your kids go to a school outside of their normal area then you are responsible for getting them there and no buses are offered.

This has resulted in to many kids wanting to go to the best schools and few wanting to go to bad school. In reality this has limited the ability of parents to change schools since all local area kids get first enrollment in local schools and then if there are any extra spots open then they are awarded based on academic competition (students with the highest GPAs get to pick first).

[Pekka]

VetLegion, it would be kind of weird. But then again, hwo about the hourly street jam with kids going to school all over the city, I mean it's 8 million people in NYC plus illegals and others who can't be accounted for. I know it's not a reason to force kids into certain close by schools but it does have its advantages.

[Pekka]

Originally posted by Oerdin
Local schools mostly get paid for by local property taxes so areas with high home prices end up getting more money. To my knowledge California is the only state who tries to even things out by having the state take all education funds and then redistributing them equally on a per student basis. Also many counties, like San Diego County where I live, have an open enrollment policy where parents can enroll their students in any school in the county though if your kids go to a school outside of their normal area then you are responsible for getting them there and no buses are offered.

This has resulted in to many kids wanting to go to the best schools and few wanting to go to bad school. In reality this has limited the ability of parents to change schools since all local area kids get first enrollment in local schools and then if there are any extra spots open then they are awarded based on academic competition (students with the highest GPAs get to pick first).

Seriously? This I didn't know. But doesn't this shape the schools so that the ones with rich parents get the good schools and the ones with no money get the schools with not that much money. Isn't that ... like a bad thing?

I mean I believe in equal opportunity. I don't think the background or the economy of parents should play a part when it comes to public schools. This would set things up for vicious cycles, where bad neighbourhoods would only remain bad and the kids wouldn't really have an equal opportunity with the other kids.

I think education is one of the few things that shoudl guarantee that everyone gets a chance. So your future would base more on your own abilities and what you choose. If you have that, the rest is gravy, and you can always say to complainers, "not my problem, you chose your path". But if I can get a head start and go to better public school, because I'd live in a rich neighbourhood... how is that equal opportunity???

[Pekka]

And I don't take the traditional Finnish way of denying good schools getting better. But the ones that aren't so good, why aren't they getting extra funding so they can be at the same level at least in theory? I mean how is this really even possible, are you sure this is the way things go in there? It sounds weird to me and something that is obviously wrong.

[Lorizael]

Actually, we even withhold funding from schools that fail to meet certain educational standards. So bad schools are likely to stay bad or possibly get worse.

[b etor]

Re: A Question About Highschools in the USA

Originally posted by VetLegion
so if you want your kids to attend a good highschool on the other end of the city, you have to move there. Correct? Or can you freely choose the schools your kids will attend? Both primary and secondary? If yes, why such pressure on moving to a good neighbourhood, when you can easily ship your kids to some distance with bus or by car?

some schools you can go to for free if you live in that district, but if you live elsewhere you have to pay a lot.

a guy at my highschool last year lived kinda near the highschool but since it was a private school it was ~$6000. his brother wanted to go to a public school in a different district and had to pay nearly $6000 as well, but he had to take long bus rides. i don't know why he did that, but they didn't move and he still went. he just had to pay a lot to go to a public school.

[Arrian]

Umm... I rather think that California is not the only state to redistribute money.

Spending Per Pupil This District State Average
Total per pupil expenditures $15,231 $12,263
Breakdown By Expenditure
Instructional 64% 64%
Student and staff support 8% 9%
Administration 11% 10%
Other expenditures 16% 17%
Source: NCES, 2004-2005

The city? Hartford, CT. Home of awful public schools. Look at the per student expenditure. How can that be, if there is no redistribution? Hartford is poor. Yet the district spends more per pupil than the state average.

-Arrian

[rah]

expenditure per student isn't always a good measurement. In the inner city in chicago, the expenditure per student isn't that bad but the gang bangers have to go somewhere until they decide to drop out. As a result the rich kids go to private schools to avoid them. The best teachers go to the private schools to avoid them. While rich doesn't always equate to smarter, there is usually higher motivation which does coorelate into doing better. So strip away a lot of top students from the public schools and it drops the average performance level of the public schools making the situation look worse than it really is.

This downward spiral usually feeds on itself.

[Heraclitus]

Originally posted by Lorizael
ZOMG PEKKA I CAN'T IMAGINE A WORLD WITHOUT SCHOOL BUSSES YOU'VE SHATTERED MY PUNY AMERICAN MIND.

The sad thing is, I've seen ecuivalent resposnes from Americans on some other forums when I try to explain how almost any public service works in my country...

[Arrian]

I'm not using it as a measure of quality, rah. I'm simply saying that that money is coming from somewhere, and I don't think it's just property taxes in Hartford.

-Arrian