Stupid laws, smug cops

[Tingkai]

You need a public safety reason? Look at those two women who died.

The law exists and drivers have a choice. If you drive at an excessively high speed, you risk getting your car impounded. If you don't want your car impounded, drive at a reasonable speed.

The choice is simple.

As for the penalty, there are various reason why we penalize people who break the law. One of them is to punish, but there is also a need to deter and prevent that person and others from breaking the law again.

Over the past 30-odd years, the number of people speeding excessively on the 401 has steadily increased. Fifteen years ago, very few people would be doing 150 kph, and they would do it in the early morning hours. The last time I was on the 401, I was doing 120 and there were idiots weaving in and out of traffic clearly driving a lot faster.

Obviously, a stronger law was needed.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Tingkai
You need a public safety reason? Look at those two women who died.

Nonsense. You need to make the case that you can guarantee drivers who speed will speed immediately after, within the next 7 days, after getting a massive ticket like that. Additionally, the police already could have taken these guys to the station anyway without impounding the cars for 7 days.

The law exists and drivers have a choice. If you drive at an excessively high speed, you risk getting your car impounded. If you don't want your car impounded, drive at a reasonable speed.

The choice is simple.

You are completely ignoring the point. Why have due process at all, in this case?

For one, it's the cops word versus the driver's word. It is not unheard of for cops to have improperly calibrated radar guns or speedometers on their cars if they clock. In fact, you'll find this is a very common argument heard in court rooms. It's very difficult to say without reason for any doubt what exact speed a vehicle was going -- especially for borderline cases.

What if you have an arrogant cop having a bad day taking his frustrations out on you? There can be no proof whatsoever you were going 50 over. Say the wrong thing and next thing you know your car is impounded for 7 days without a trial or any presentation of evidence. You are assuming cops are always right, radar guns are never wrong or miscalibrated, and impounding the car without a trial would have prevented the tragedy over the weekend. Of course, that is all nonsense. I've no problem with impounding the car for 30 days -- as long as there is a trial. Impounding the car isn't the issue, it's the lack of any kind of justice procedures.

The issue is due process. There is no comparison between confiscating a drunk driver's car and confiscating a car that was one point was going faster than the speed limit. I think you'll find most people, especially after getting a $1,000+ ticket for speeding, will hold off on speeding immediately afterwards.

Again, I've no problem with punishing speeders -- especially speeders 50 over the limit -- but I do have a problem with punishing them without a trial. I find it shameful that you do not.

As you said, these people were allegedly racing -- but you forget that they were also allegedly speeding. There has been no trial.

Obviously, a stronger law was needed.

That stronger law did nothing to prevent this, did it?

What's needed is a safe venue for people to race in. See my Star article cite from earlier -- that's how you prevent this kind of stuff. I don't think you get it that people who take their beamers and Audis out to race aren't exactly thinking about getting caught. The law clearly doesn't prevent this from happening.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Asher
What's needed is a safe venue for people to race in.

Or we can make racing cars illegal.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Kidicious
Or we can make racing cars illegal.

It already is, chief. Has been forever.

That's not stopping it from happening.

Thus, there needs to be a way for people to do it away from the public streets.

[Spec]

It exists already. I have 4 race course closer than 100 km from my home. One is 12 km from my house.

Drag racing for open public tuesaday to thursday nights, lapping on and auto-x on saturday and drifting on sunday.
Motorcycle drag racing is on monday nights.

I'm sure we are not alone having this.

Spec.

[Asher]

Of course it exists already. Just not here -- not affordably, anyway.

Does your city have a big "street racing" problem, by chance?

[Spec]

Originally posted by Kidicious


Or we can make racing cars illegal.

That would be ridiculous.

I never had an accident in my life (knocking on wood) and I drive very safely. Cars are my passion and it is so for a lot of people. We do not deserve this because of some stupid civic racers cant be mature enough on the roads.

Spec.

[Wezil]

I'm not opposed to a track where amateurs can race "safely" (so long as my tax money doesn't pay for it), but I'm not convinced it would be effective. These street "racers" don't choose quiet industrial zones with long straightaways to do their racing, they choose the 400 series highways. I'm not sure we are talking about people with enough sense to drive any sort of distance to find an approved site.

[Spec]

Originally posted by Asher
Of course it exists already. Just not here -- not affordably, anyway.

Does your city have a big "street racing" problem, by chance?

Well, yea....Kind of....like anywhere else I suppose. I dont know, really.

It only costs 5$ a night for drag racing.

Only 5$ and you can race all night long vs anyone you want. Pretty awesome.

35$ for drifting all sunday long (10 to 6 )

Spec.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Wezil
I'm not opposed to a track where amateurs can race "safely" (so long as my tax money doesn't pay for it), but I'm not convinced it would be effective. These street "racers" don't choose quiet industrial zones with long straightaways to do their racing, they choose the 400 series highways. I'm not sure we are talking about people with enough sense to drive any sort of distance to find an approved site.

This weekend's accident wasn't on a 400 series highway? It was highway 50.

I've also never seen street racers on the 401 and I drive it a lot after midnight.

[Wezil]

Originally posted by Asher

This weekend's accident wasn't on a 400 series highway? It was highway 50.

I've also never seen street racers on the 401 and I drive it a lot after midnight.

I stand corrected. They were on the quiet highway 50.

My point still stays the same.

[Dinner]

I imagine the Canadian street races do the same thing the street races did around here when I was in high school. They found a nice empty back road with a long straight away not some major freeway with lots of police on it.

[Wezil]

Originally posted by Oerdin
I imagine the Canadian street races do the same thing the street races did around here when I was in high school. They found a nice empty back road with a long straight away not some major freeway with lots of police on it.

Um, no. That is what you and I did.

These guys are going on well traveled and often busy highways. Highway 400 is a favourite.

[Asher]

I really don't think a lot of the racers go on the 400s or busy highways. I think it's a rarity for the especially stupid. I've never seen anyone street racing on the 400s and I drive a lot when they're relatively deserted near the middle of the night.

I think more accidents occur on the busy roadways, so when races do occur there we hear more about them. For obvious reasons, drag racing on the abandoned roads don't result in all that many accidents compared to busy roads.

[Wezil]

Originally posted by Asher
I think more accidents occur on the busy roadways, so when races do occur there we hear more about them. For obvious reasons, drag racing on the abandoned roads don't result in all that many accidents compared to busy roads.

I think I agree, but these "racers" aren't really the problem are they? It is the ones that insist on driving on the busy roads that need to be dealt with.