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  • Evil Finn?

    Or just dumber than a sack of hammers?



    Comments in interview could bring charges of inciting racism against PM Vanhanen's father
    Prime Minister regrets controversy sparked by Professor Tatu Vanhanen

    The National Bureau of Investigation (NBI) is considering whether or not to launch a criminal investigation into comments made by Professor Emeritus Tatu Vanhanen in an interview with Kuukausiliite, a monthly magazine supplement of Helsingin Sanomat.
    In the interview Professor Vanhanen, a former Professor of Political Science at the University of Tampere, said that evolution has made Europeans and North Americans more intelligent than Africans. Prime Minister Matti Vanhanen said on Wednesday that he regrets the controversy sparked by Tatu Vanhanen, who is his father.

    Professor Vanhanen told Kuukausiliite that African poverty is not the fault of the white man.
    "Whereas the average IQ of Finns is 97, in Africa it is between 60 and 70. Differences in intelligence are the most significant factor in explaining poverty", Vanhanen said.
    He also said that it might be a good thing if as many Europeans, Americans, and Asians as possible were to take on leading economic posts in African countries. "Only they are capable of creating prosperity", he said.
    On the other hand, Tatu Vanhanen said that he favours economic solidarity toward poor countries, and he hopes that immigrants in Finland would inter-marry and assimilate into the population at large.

    Jari Liukku, deputy head of the NBI, says that the police are investigating whether or not Vanhanen's comments constitute public incitement against a national group, which is a crime under Finnish law.
    Liukku would not say if Helsingin Sanomat was being investigated for publishing the interview.
    "This is a precedent. Nothing like this has been put forward before. We want to go through international cases before making any decisions."

    Finland’s minority Ombudsman Mikko Puumalainen hopes that a police investigation will be launched. He says that although freedom of expression is a fundamental right in Finland, the right is not unlimited.
    Puumalainen also dismissed the scientific validity of Vanhanen’s claims.
    The Finnish League for Human Rights fears that Vanhanen’s interview could aggravate the racism experienced by immigrants and ethnic minorities in Finland.
    "This interview could strengthen movements of the far right", says Aysu Shakir, a project head at the league.
    Shakir notes that after the publication of the interview, Internet chat rooms have filled up with comments by extreme right-wing groups and individuals who "swear by Vanhanen’s name".

    Commenting on his father’s interview, Prime Minister Matti Vanhanen said that it case was "more a sad matter than a burden" for him.
    Speaking to reporters on Wednesday, the Prime Minister said that the controversy would not have arisen if the person making the comments were not his father.
    Asked if he felt a need to distance himself from the views that Tatu Vanhanen expressed, he said that he does not plan to engage in public debate with his father.
    The genesis of the "evil Finn" concept- Evil, evil Finland

  • #2
    Neither.
    www.my-piano.blogspot

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    • #3
      That didn't sound that bad at all... frankly depending on the context there could be nothing wrong whatsoever with that.

      Big Brother
      <Reverend> IRC is just multiplayer notepad.
      I like your SNOOPY POSTER! - While you Wait quote.

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      • #4
        Prosecuting him is absurd, of course, but I found this amusing:

        "Whereas the average IQ of Finns is 97

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        • #5
          there clearly isn't much crime in finland, if this sort of thing is a criminal matter.
          "The Christian way has not been tried and found wanting, it has been found to be hard and left untried" - GK Chesterton.

          "The most obvious predicition about the future is that it will be mostly like the past" - Alain de Botton

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          • #6
            Evolution? I'd go with guns, germs and steel.
            I've allways wanted to play "Russ Meyer's Civilization"

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            • #7
              He should be announcing sports
              Monkey!!!

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              • #8
                His views square with what we know about intelligence, and what we generally observe in the world around us. Why should he be prosecuted?
                ...people like to cry a lot... - Pekka
                ...we just argue without evidence, secure in our own superiority. - Snotty

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                • #9
                  If he's guilty for speaking his mind then the magazine should also be held guilty for printing it... "although freedom of expression is a fundamental right in Finland, the right is not unlimited."

                  (what kind of BS is that?)
                  Monkey!!!

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                  • #10
                    He has transgressed against the high priests of the offended, and their wrath doth wax hot.
                    ...people like to cry a lot... - Pekka
                    ...we just argue without evidence, secure in our own superiority. - Snotty

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Japher
                      If he's guilty for speaking his mind then the magazine should also be held guilty for printing it... "although freedom of expression is a fundamental right in Finland, the right is not unlimited."

                      (what kind of BS is that?)
                      Do you have the right to yell "FIRE!" in a crowded theater when there is none?

                      Same thing, but Finland expands it to hate speech.
                      meet the new boss, same as the old boss

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                      • #12
                        I can see the controversy. Though nothing illegal about it.

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                        • #13
                          so who's mad? The Africans for him saying that 'only foreigners can bring prosperity' to their countries or the Finns for him suggesting that the bread with foreigners to help them assimilate?

                          I really don't think his comments are bad. Maybe tactless, but a reasonable observation and issue that should be addressed and not ignored, or even worse than ignored; not even identified for fear of persecution.

                          IMO, this is not the same thing as yelling FIRE in a crowded theater, not even at the national level. It's someone acknowledging that there is a difference in social constructs and attempting to justify that difference and then finding a solution. Much better than ignoring it, as per Australia and their Aboriginies who now seem to be a problem because they are hooked on drugs and child porn.

                          Ignoring a problem doesn't make it go away. Punishing someone who points out a problem definitly doesn't make it go away.

                          Hate speach? Perhaps I too far removed from racism to see it as such.
                          Monkey!!!

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by mrmitchell
                            Do you have the right to yell "FIRE!" in a crowded theater when there is none?

                            Same thing, but Finland expands it to hate speech.
                            That's an inane comparison. There's no similarity between the two cases.

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                            • #15
                              The "race as science" baloney has been pushed for over 100 years now, and it continues to produce no respectable results, for many reasons but starting with that there is no biological definition of race to begin with, no single trait that every person of a certain group has or doesn't have. Once that is established it is a lot easier for people to (correctly) consider that the achievement gap, crime rates, etc. are better correlated with income and social status.

                              If you don't think the claim that Europeans are just naturally smarter than Africans is racist or hateful, I guess you are too removed from racism. Remember that claims like this were used throughout the 1900s to justify the socially-caused inequalities between groups, especially in the US.

                              As far as Mr. Vanhanen is concerned, I think he's probably just an old codger and a relic of the past that grew up in a time when this kind of thinking was tolerated. "He didn't know any better" isn't a complete excuse, but at the same time I am not sure whether to be gung-ho for hate speech criminalization and would personally let him off easy.
                              meet the new boss, same as the old boss

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