BTS and the upcoming slavery nerf

[DrSpike]

Civ4 is not a good duel game - I gave it up after a month or so (also in top 10) before slavery was all the rage, but whatever happens with that in BtS I wouldn't expect it to work as a package.

It's a great game for bigger MP games like Rah's group play though, providing you have the time.

[Solver]

YOU were in Top10? Oh my...

[EyesOfNight]

Yeah, he got top 10. I played him quite a few times, in fact my games with him made me quit. Those were the classic 1v1 pre-slavery games where you chose Inca, got about 5 cities, and just built as many axemen and catapults as possible. Neither side could take out a city so you'd march your stack in, it'd get destroyed, then he'd march his stack in and you'd destroy it. Just ****ing ridiculous. Then you'd scramble for points in the final turns. There's a reason there was a mass exodus from Civ4 shortly after I left.

[DrSpike]

Originally posted by Solver
YOU were in Top10? Oh my...

You should stick to giving out tips from the manual for our newer players. You're very good at it and probably best you don't go further.

[DrSpike]

Originally posted by EyesOfNight
Yeah, he got top 10. I played him quite a few times, in fact my games with him made me quit. Those were the classic 1v1 pre-slavery games where you chose Inca, got about 5 cities, and just built as many axemen and catapults as possible. Neither side could take out a city so you'd march your stack in, it'd get destroyed, then he'd march his stack in and you'd destroy it. Just ****ing ridiculous. Then you'd scramble for points in the final turns.

I could probably have lived with the flaws with a decent ladder. For those not familiar with it, it (unless it has changed) tries to cater to all tastes. However, the top ranked players were predominantly cton players, mostly pretty weak, and they would tend to only play large games with others from the same group.

Thus it was very difficult for players to progress above weaker players, which is a pretty essential characteristic for a vibrant ladder.

Eyes never tried - his performance was on rating not ladder rank. I tried to match my rating with ranking, but wish I hadn't, and could never get above rank 10 or so. I spent more time explaining to players dodging me that their behaviour undermined the ladder than I did playing towards the end. You could mount a formal challenge, but players could always defer for a week under the rules, by which times the general movement of the ladder could often render the challenge moot.

I'll probably keep an eye on what BtS brings, but unless they are willing to make a few changes to make the game more duel friendly I wont come back. And they probably wont, since most of the playerbase seems to prefer the larger games, and as I said I think Civ4 is pretty good for those.

[Solver]

Originally posted by DrSpike




You should stick to giving out tips from the manual for our newer players. You're very good at it and probably best you don't go further.

Your dislike for me notwithstanding, that's certainly an interesting consideration

[DrSpike]

Actually if you'll check back I was just responding to your unprovoked remark.

[Solver]

That was no remark, it was a cute little jab

[EyesOfNight]

DrSpike, there's actually a guy who I sent a proposal to on how to create a new ladder who is interested in it. What's more, he's part of the C4P staff. lol I don't know if he'll go through with it, but it will have a 1v1 ladder, a cton ladder, and a team ladder as well as clan ranking. It doesn't matter how good the ladder is though, if they **** the gameplay up more than it already is then nobody will stick around to play on the ladder anyway. I will however really enjoy watching CockSoldier lose his precious position in the community. That alone will be worth it.

[DrSpike]

Originally posted by Solver
That was no remark, it was a cute little jab

As was mine.

[Japher]

Ban Solver!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

[DrSpike]

Originally posted by EyesOfNight
DrSpike, there's actually a guy who I sent a proposal to on how to create a new ladder who is interested in it. What's more, he's part of the C4P staff. lol I don't know if he'll go through with it, but it will have a 1v1 ladder, a cton ladder, and a team ladder as well as clan ranking.

Don't want to be a doomsayer but I think C4P has a lot of inertia behind it, and most of the C4P players have no reason to move from the existing ladder.

[MJW]

So, denfense is overpowered in 1v1. That makes sense. The game was deisgened to make defense stronger than attacking. If this where not the case the larger games would be broken. Sure everything would be okay as long as the fights where 1v1 but against anything else the group that attacks would own totaly and quickly. It would feel like an RTS free-for-all save the 1v1 fights. Which would not happen alot because the fighters would quickly fall behind.

[EyesOfNight]

Don't want to be a doomsayer but I think C4P has a lot of inertia behind it, and most of the C4P players have no reason to move from the existing ladder.

Actually they do. Nobody really likes C4P, there's just never been another option. Plus, you'd be amazed what a little propaganda will do. I learned how to kill ladders over the years, I can do it with C4P too if this certain someone pulls through on the technical end. We'll see what happens.

[EyesOfNight]

So, denfense is overpowered in 1v1. That makes sense. The game was deisgened to make defense stronger than attacking. If this where not the case the larger games would be broken. Sure everything would be okay as long as the fights where 1v1 but against anything else the group that attacks would own totaly and quickly. It would feel like an RTS free-for-all save the 1v1 fights. Which would not happen alot because the fighters would quickly fall behind.

It's not really that defense is overpowered, it's that it's so hard to get ahead that it turns into a stalemate very easily. Slavery has corrected that to a degree, but if they nerf slavery then we will return to the days of stalemates and catapult/axeman stack wars where no one could get ahead.