BTS and the upcoming slavery nerf

[EyesOfNight]

From what I've heard, slavery is going to be nerfed in BTS...and it really needs to be. The game is practically based on slavery at this point and makes the game so 1 dimensional it gets boring very quickly. On the other hand, slavery is about the only thing that allows you to gain any sort of lead over lesser players. Anyone who played original Civ4 before people realized how powerful slavery was will remember what a horrible grind the game was. If they don't do something to increase the gap between lesser players and the better players, we will go back to the grind in BTS, the same grind that made many players quit. Not only that, but the importance of forests and hills will become overpowered again as people will have to rely on production. On the one hand, slavery has to be nerfed, it's clearly overpowered, but nerfing it will magnify the equalizing effects of Civ4. At least with slavery, even though it's ****ing boring and repetitive, you can at least get somewhat of a lead over lower level players.

[ZEE]

i actually agree with this. I am a much better player than I am allowed to show in Civ 4, because of the ridiculous and stupid handicaps they put on REXing and other factors. Anybody who knows me from my ToT days on here (Bauser), or my Zone days (masta_nAi), knows that while i was clearly not on EoN's level (i think he whipped me on The Zone several times) i was actually one of the best players in the world. I am not kidding or lying. I honestly do not like Civ 4. there I said it!
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[Q Classic]

While that's a nice sentiment, I do hope you won't be offended when I ask you to take the post to some place a bit more germane? We don't take kindly to on-topic posts 'round these parts.

...or DO we?

(A slavery nerf will be somewhat disappointing--it's one of the few ways I can eke production out of a city about to turn very unhappy.)

[Japher]

Is this about a game or something?

[DinoDoc]

Wrong forum.

[EyesOfNight]

There's so much wrong with Civ4 it's simply not fixable in patches. Then on top of it you have guys like CanuckSoldier (aka DarkStorm) from Civ2 weighing in on gameplay matters and beta testing. Anyone who remembers this guy from Civ2 knows how ridiculous it is to have him on a beta testing team. Right now all I'm hoping for is that Civ4 will remain playable, if not enjoyable, and that they'll learn from their mistakes and fix it for Civ5. I'm not holding my breath though. I predict that Civ5 will be the final installment when it flops due to the amount of people that were turned off by Civ4.

And AAHZ...totally agree with you. They handicap the **** out of the better player and reward the lesser player.

[EyesOfNight]

I can't post this in the On topic forum...why? Because it's a bunch of god damn single player newbies. Hell, the fact is 99% of the MP players even are newbies. All the good players quit this game pre-slavery original Civ4 for the problems I mentioned before. So, I'm hoping some of the old good players from previous civ games weigh in here, and maybe some of the very few good players left in Civ4.

[Japher]

So, you're looking for quality posts in the OT?

Good luck.

[EyesOfNight]

The sad thing is that I'm more likely to get quality posts here than in On-Topic. In On-Topic I'll get a bunch of idiots telling me "You just don't understand the game yet." Then they'll go on to talk about all the supposed options in the game. Then I'll ask them if they've played MP before and they'll say, "no, but that doesn't matter." So it's here, or nowhere.

[ZEE]

im sorry but i have to vent this as it has been bothering me since i played civ4 for the first time.

I ABSOLUTELY HATE THE CORRUPTION SYSTEM!! and they BLATENTLY LIE when they claim that corruption was not even coded into the game, when all they did was RENAME THE DAMN THING! it is now called maintenance or something!! The fact that i cannot build 10 cities before 1000 BC without going broke is so damn ridiculous i want to throw the damn game in the trash!

I was one of the BEST CIV PLAYERS ON PLANET EARTH! Now i play like a damn NOOB because i cannot afford any damn cities until the middle ages or later!

there i feel better now...
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[OzzyKP]

You just don't understand the game yet.

[ZEE]

thats just it. there is nothing to understand about it...

civ2, even parts of civ3, had certain rules and tricks that if you knew them could be a SIGNIFICANT advantage over a NOOB. Like Martial Law limits, tile counting, city spacing, huge wonder perks, Governmental advantages like the fundy build-rush etc, etc..

now the game is totally dumbed down... and damn near unplayable IMHO.
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[OzzyKP]

Heh, Civ4 sucks because it eliminated all the sleezy exploits players like you depended on to win?

Sounds like the best endorsement I've heard yet.

[Solver]

You remain as hilarious as ever EoN

[EyesOfNight]

Those weren't sleezy exploits. Even Ming and the others realize the game seriously hampers players. It's the same issue on Deity level vs King level in Civ2. When you remove options and you slow down expansion and you decrease the amount of options you increase the ability of lesser players to stay in the game. When you're only dealing with 6 cities or so early on, it's very easy for any newbie to keep up with that. A 1 city lead really doesn't mean **** and that's about all you can expect unless you're playing against someone who just absolutely sucks. There's no such thing as tech rushing, you have to stick to the same path as everyone else or you die. There's simply no ability in this game to do something out of the ordinary. A big lead in Civ4 is having 2 more cities and catapults 10 turns sooner than the other guy. WOWIE! What the **** is that? I spend an hour grinding it out to get such a small lead? It's not that the other player is preventing me from getting the lead, it's the system. There is simply no way to get around the maintinence system, period. You must follow the same route as everyone else and you must do the same thing as everyone else. Even the best players in Civ4 that still continue to play it will tell you the exact same thing. Civ4 can be summed up very easily: Less options, slower gameplay, unresponsive interface, and a combat system from hell.