CDN Politics - Liberal Leadership race

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Does that mean that it's simply a perception issue if a Presidential candidate was a cannibal?

As far as I'm aware he hasn't been accused of any criminal activity, so I fail to see the basis for comparison.

[KrazyHorse]

Thanks for deliberately missing the point, little one.

Just because something in his past isn't criminal and doesn't contravene any legal requirement toward becoming PM doesn't mean that voters shouldn't pay attention to it.

Ignatieff was out of the country for 27 years. He can't help but have an outsider's perspective on Canada, its people and its future. Why should we disregard that?

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by Wezil
Tell me DD, would a presidential aspirant that was out of the US for 27 years not have to face this issue?

There is no such thing as an American that is out of the US for 27 years. No American would dare leave the homeland that long, and no person who did would still admit to being an American by the end of it.

[CrONoS]

http://www.canada.com/topics/news/features/liberalleadership2006/story.html?id=d275617c-386c-4ff6-87a6-068af6e2cd43

Ignatieff Also, good scores for Dion and Kennedy!

# Michael Ignatieff: 1412
# Bob Rae: 977
# Stéphane Dion: 856
# Gerard Kennedy: 854
# Ken Dryden: 238
# Scott Brison: 192
# Joe Volpe: 156
# Martha Hall Findlay: 130
Ignatieff leads after first ballot, but outcome still in question

Norma Greenaway, CanWest News Service
Published: Friday, December 01, 2006
Article tools

MONTREAL – The results of the first ballot in the Liberal leadership race show front-runner Michael Ignatieff still has a tough uphill climb to win the prize.

Ignatieff remained out front with 29.3 per cent of the vote, almost exactly what he had based on the elected delegates he got in the super weekend of voting in September.

Bob Rae held his second-place slot, garnering 20.3 per cent of the vote and ending up with slightly less than a 10-point deficit against Ignatieff. The former Ontario premier remained slightly ahead of Stephane Dion and Gerard Kennedy, who remained in a virtual tie for third.

Ignatieff's tally was short of the more than 30 per cent his backers had been predicting, indicating he did not collect the support from ex-officio delegates he had been expecting.

The votes broke down this way: Ignatieff, 1,412 (29.3 per cent); Rae, 977 (20.3 per cent); Dion, 856 (17.8 per cent); Kennedy 854 (17.7 per cent) Ken Dryden; 238 (4.9 per cent); Joe Volpe, 156 (3.2 per cent); Scott Brison, 192 (4.1 per cent); Martha Hall Findlay, 130 (2.7 per cent).

In a major development Friday night, Volpe announced he is going to Rae on the second ballot. Some of his delegates were expected to follow, and a few, led by former MP Nick Discepola of Montreal, went to Ignatieff.

Second-ballot voting begins Saturday morning at 9 a.m. It represents the first round of voting during which most delegates will no longer be committed to a specific candidate.
***
Edit:

Canadian politics is flooding poly out-topics!!!

[Ninot]

damnit, Dryden should win!

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Wezil

It appears the poll was by region, not province. Albertans will vote Conservative no doubt.

And BC, and Saskatchewan, and Manitoba, and rural Ontario, and parts of Quebec, and...

If you think Harper had a problem with his political past when he became leader of the CPC, you're right.

Just imagine the weight Rae will be carrying around his neck after the **** storm he created in Ontario. If Harper was tarred with Harris, just wait until it is pointed out who Harris was the answer to.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Wezil

GST - Yes, he cut it by 1% then did nothing to ensure it was passed on by lower levels of government. Well done. Also, simultaneously RAISED the lowest tax bracket from 16% to 16.5%. Net loss.

I don't understand your reference to lower levels of government. Please explain.

As for overall tax rates, he did what he campaigned on. Your question was what promise had he kept. Is this a kept promise?

Your arguement about which is better is cute, but also surrenders the initial point, especially when he campaigned on knocking back the Liberal drop from 16.5% to 16% in favour of the cut in the GST.

FAA - The federal accountability commissioner claims this Act will make the Federal government LESS accountable. Kind of like the "Clean Air Act" - Call it one thing when it is actually the opposite.

The what?

Tough on Crime - Nothing passed and not likely to. W/O consultation with others in parliament this is just political grandstanding.

It's called a minority government. Nothing passes without support outside the Conservative caucus.

Child Care - Granted. He did do this.

Did you choke on this one? No qualification?

Sorry, Wezil, but if you can opine on the political proclivities of an entire province in a pithy response, I can surely observe that it seems an individual would have a tough decision if forced to choose between Harper and the anti-Christ.

Talking w/ Provinces - As with Gun crime - keep talking.

What hasn't he done? Delivered government differently (as was also promised). He is the same old same old I have come to expect in Cdn politics.

It is entirely reasonable to question Harper on his principles, and take him to task for the things he has done that disappoint. Feel free.

Dumb ass comments about 'what promise has he kept' are begging for an argument at best, and more deserving of the cesspool of American political threads at worst.

Carry on.

[CrONoS]

Why he lowered down the GST by 1%? Why he didn't lowered the tax on income?

Is there any economic advantage to lowering down the GST against lowering down the tax on income?

I always thought that tax on consumption were better than any tax on income.

[notyoueither]

Well, there are people who do not pay income tax but who do pay GST whenever they spend money on discretionary items, like food at the catering truck for lunch at work, or clothes.

I actually agree with many. I prefer a significant tax on consumption, however the point was what promises were kept. An obvious one is the one where Harper promised to roll back the Liberal plan for an income tax cut in favour of a cut in the GST.

[notyoueither]

As for why he favoured a cut to the GST instead of the income tax cut?

Politics.

Remember the Red Book? Axe da tax? It was a sore point for some who needed more pushing to get them off the roll of Liberal voters (rural Ontario and Quebec).

Putting it through in the first budget is going to serve as an exclamation point in many future debates with many Liberals on the campaign trail.

[CrONoS]

Originally posted by notyoueither
Well, there are people who do not pay income tax but who do pay GST whenever they spend money on discretionary items, like food at the catering truck for lunch at work, or clothes..

true, but people, who don't make enought money are already receiving a check by the federal government. (TPS refund each 3 or 4 month)

One easy way to raise our national productivity is by lowering the tax on income.

Lowering the tax on consumption is not creating more saving and not creating new incentive to work more.

p.s.:
If I was perfectly bilingual, I would write a much better post than this one.

[CrONoS]

Yep I was already knowing, it was an old promised from the conservatives. I thought maybe somebody could point me some good macroeconomics reason behind this.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by cronos_qc


true, but people, who don't make enought money are already receiving a check by the federal government. (TPS refund each 3 or 4 month)

Many people with low incomes do not file tax returns. No return, no refunds.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by cronos_qc
Yep I was already knowing, it was an old promised from the conservatives. I thought maybe somebody could point me some good macroeconomics reason behind this.

The point wasn't an old promise by Conservatives. In fact it was Conservatives who brought in the GST to replace an older, hidden tax.

The point was to revive memories of Liberals promising to kill the tax who then promptly ignored the promises. Something Wezil is accusing Harper of.

[CrONoS]

@Notyou

Yep you're right I'm remembering now; Mulroney replaced an old tax(who was hidden, I dont which kind of tax that was... a tax on export/import???) by the GST and Jean Chretien promised to cut completely the GST.

Edit:
Oh yeah, and I remember the famous Helicopters, Chretien broke the deal, that Mulroney had!! (Cormoran... ??) Anyway this is really out topic