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Texas lawmakers struck hard at illegal immigrants Monday

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  • #136
    Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
    It isn't like it is difficult for people to walk over the border to come to a hospital on the US side of the border if they wanted to. You think that making them legal is going to lead to more trips?
    Amnesty increases the incentive to immigrate, and in turn increases immigration.

    Especially since if they are legal, they'll most likely have W2s and paychecks with their real addresses on them?
    Do you really think Jose and Maria are going to provide those details if they don't have to? Dream on.

    And a new equilibrium will develop. Perhaps it will cost more for the first 1-2 years, but after that, welfare goes away in most cases. The number of min wage jobs rise as the workers become legal.
    How on earth is the number of minimum wage jobs going to increase along with the supply of workers? Basic economics will tell you that an increase in the supply of workers will lead to a decrease in wages, and hence a decrease in the number of minimum wage jobs.

    I think the CIS analysis overstates the rise in costs for programs like Medicaid and Federal Education which illegals already get right now.
    What makes you say it is overstated? Can you point to anything concrete to refute what they are saying?

    What problems? Just because you think 2nd and 3rd generation Mexican citizens are lazy doesn't make it so.
    Again, you need to read up on what people who have looked into this say.
    ...people like to cry a lot... - Pekka
    ...we just argue without evidence, secure in our own superiority. - Snotty

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    • #137
      Originally posted by SlowwHand
      Even as a mere opinion, that's not much of an argument.
      Why, you think that illegals aren't sending their kids to public schools right now? Or aren't taking advantage of Medicaid programs available to them? And that they will flood to do so once they are legal?
      “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
      - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

      Comment

      • #138
        Originally posted by SlowwHand


        Even as a mere opinion, that's not much of an argument.
        Imran's opinions don't seem to be based on anything more than over-optimistic speculation.
        ...people like to cry a lot... - Pekka
        ...we just argue without evidence, secure in our own superiority. - Snotty

        Comment

        • #139
          Originally posted by Caligastia
          Amnesty increases the incentive to immigrate, and in turn increases immigration.
          And yet, if they wanted to go to a US hospital, they wouldn't HAVE to immigrate. They could just walk over, right? Of course immigration will increase and you will get some deadbeat payers in that new sample, but lets realize that legal immigrants will be far less likely to deadbeat than illegals (who may think they'll be found out).

          Do you really think Jose and Maria are going to provide those details if they don't have to? Dream on.
          If they can get legal status, of course they will. They'll be little to no risk for providing such info.

          How on earth is the number of minimum wage jobs going to increase along with the supply of workers? Basic economics will tell you that an increase in the supply of workers will lead to a decrease in wages, and hence a decrease in the number of minimum wage jobs.
          Because they'll be a marked decrease in the sub-min wage jobs. Those sub-min wage jobs are going to have to become min wage jobs when the light is shined (W2 forms especially), hence the number of min wage jobs increases.

          What makes you say it is overstated? Can you point to anything concrete to refute what they are saying?
          Just in seeing that federal education and medicaid are already provided to illegal immigrants due to Supreme Court decisions. Why exactly would, say, the federal education budget go up if the illegal->legal immigrants use the exact same education services?
          “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
          - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

          Comment

          • #140
            Originally posted by Caligastia
            Imran's opinions don't seem to be based on anything more than over-optimistic speculation.
            It's called common sense, I suggest you look into it
            “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
            - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

            Comment

            • #141
              Because they'll be a marked decrease in the sub-min wage jobs. Those sub-min wage jobs are going to have to become min wage jobs when the light is shined (W2 forms especially), hence the number of min wage jobs increases.
              why? are you also expecting vigorous enforcement in your hypothetical?

              Comment

              • #142
                Ok, let's change the circumstances a little.

                How about Pakistan let all Indians come and go at will?
                Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

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                • #143


                  Human beings should have more freedom than goods and services.
                  "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                  -Bokonon

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                  • #144
                    You don't get it, Ramo. This isn't simple economics.
                    Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                    "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                    He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

                    Comment

                    • #145
                      Originally posted by Whoha
                      why? are you also expecting vigorous enforcement in your hypothetical?
                      I would assume better enforcement against paying under min wage due to more transparency. I'm sure the IRS would be wondering why people who are registered as legal don't have W2's filed or whatnot. Unlike the INS, the IRS is very well funded in satisfying its curiousities . And that opens things up against those companies.

                      So, yeah, I guess there would be more vigourous enforcement, but from other agencies that currently are doing so (I'd imagine there would be some anonymous complaints to the Department of Labor as well).
                      “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                      - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

                      Comment

                      • #146
                        Originally posted by SlowwHand
                        Ok, let's change the circumstances a little.

                        How about Pakistan let all Indians come and go at will?
                        Fine by me and vice versa. Though I wouldn't object to them not letting in people who are convicted felons or terrorists.
                        “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                        - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

                        Comment

                        • #147
                          When Pakistan and all other countries operate on the sieve principle, check back and let the paranoid USA know, ok?
                          Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                          "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                          He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

                          Comment

                          • #148
                            You don't get it, Ramo. This isn't simple economics.
                            The parts where it isn't simple economics, i.e. security would be benefited by the legalization of free immigration.
                            "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                            -Bokonon

                            Comment

                            • #149
                              Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


                              Fine by me and vice versa. Though I wouldn't object to them not letting in people who are convicted felons or terrorists.
                              How the **** are you going to determine that one?

                              Give me a break, Imran. You're sounding like an idiot.
                              Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                              "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                              He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

                              Comment

                              • #150
                                The same way they determine it right now - documentation, background checks, etc.
                                "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                                -Bokonon

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