Is Iran Picking a Fight?

[snoopy369]

Huh? GePap, do you have any knowledge of how the military works? Or just enough to be totally misinformed...

You're right that it's hard to invade a country with no localized bases to resupply from. Such is the reason that, among others, no-one has ever made a serious attempt to occupy American soil outside of the Canada-based British, and the Mexico-based Spanish/Mexicans.

The US has control of the country of Iraq, however, to base itself from. We also have plenty of aircraft that can transit from the U.S. to Iraq, not to mention transit via Germany or other STRONG allies. We also have the most powerful navy in the world, and have been doing quite a lot of our resupplying through that method. That's why quite a few of our Naval resources are mobilized.

The problem militaries have OCCUPYING other nations come from the ultimate need for the cooperation of the governed to properly govern a nation, not from supply issues (in the modern era).

[GePap]

Originally posted by PLATO


If ignorance is bliss, then I congratulate you on a happy life!

The key here is the political will to do things that are necessary to subdue a population. The U.S. has led a VERY vanilla occupation. I can assure you that a quite sizable portion of the Iraqi's would help us as well for the right price.

So you are arguing what is politically utterly unrealistic, but in some random ass universe plausible? That is your "arguement"?

Your thoughts of Kuwait and Saudi are ludicrous. The Kuwaitis and the Saudis hate the Iraqis...and that has nothing to do with religion.

This is priceless...well, actually, worthless.

KSA and Kuwait both have internal constituencies they have to deal with, and the "street" in these countries, especially KSA, is more anti-American than anti-Iraqi. If the USa cted as you suggest the US would act, then those governments would have no choice, unless they wanted to put their necks out for the US, to disavow US behavior.

At the end of the day PLATO, if we went back 3 years and looked at what you and I said about the future of the Iraqi enterprise, who was closer to what has actually transpired? Oh, yeah. So why do you think your ability to predict any future has improved over 2003?

[GePap]

Originally posted by snoopy369

The US has control of the country of Iraq, however, to base itself from. We also have plenty of aircraft that can transit from the U.S. to Iraq, not to mention transit via Germany or other STRONG allies. We also have the most powerful navy in the world, and have been doing quite a lot of our resupplying through that method. That's why quite a few of our Naval resources are mobilized.

Bases within Iraq that can only be supplied fully from the outside. No ally of the US would have any political reason to support an unwated US occupation of Iraq. They barely tolerate the current US occupation. Note as well that the US navy can keep sea lanes open. They can;pt do **** about making sure the trucks don't get blown up on the roads from the port. And airlift could not support the level of forces in Iraq, beyond the fact that those aircraft would have to come from bases in allied territory.

People have a trulyl weird view of US power. The US is paramount in military power because most of the rest of the world has said, OK, whatever, and they do little to actively conuteract it. The US has reach because it has friends. It has friends because it does not act like PLATO think the US could act in Iraq. The day the US acts in Iraq like PLATO think we could is the day other countries decide US bases uin their territory is not comething they care to have, and maybe they should spend 2-3% more of their GNP on the military.

US hegemony is built on the fact that eveyrone accepts it. The day the world decides the US is not a relatively benign hegemon is the day the US is ****ed.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by GePap


Bases within Iraq that can only be supplied fully from the outside. No ally of the US would have any political reason to support an unwated US occupation of Iraq. They barely tolerate the current US occupation. Note as well that the US navy can keep sea lanes open. They can;pt do **** about making sure the trucks don't get blown up on the roads from the port. And airlift could not support the level of forces in Iraq, beyond the fact that those aircraft would have to come from bases in allied territory.

People have a trulyl weird view of US power. The US is paramount in military power because most of the rest of the world has said, OK, whatever, and they do little to actively conuteract it. The US has reach because it has friends. It has friends because it does not act like PLATO think the US could act in Iraq. The day the US acts in Iraq like PLATO think we could is the day other countries decide US bases uin their territory is not comething they care to have, and maybe they should spend 2-3% more of their GNP on the military.

US hegemony is built on the fact that eveyrone accepts it. The day the world decides the US is not a relatively benign hegemon is the day the US is ****ed.

Wow! Talk about the last refuge of the incompetent!!

I NEVER suggested that we take this course of action...merely that we could. And if you think the Saudi's are going to wreck our relationship over a stern hand in Iraq, then you have a very, very limited understanding of the relationship...particularly if we are doing it to control an Iranian inspired insurection. Additionally, most of the world probably would applaude a strong hand in Iraq. Really Gepap! I can hardly stop laughing enough to type! Go accuse somebody who can't so easily figure out that your attempts to put words in people's mouths is only exceeded by you ability to put a foot in yours!

[GePap]

Originally posted by PLATO


Wow! Talk about the last refuge of the incompetent!!

I NEVER suggested that we take this course of action...merely that we could. And if you think the Saudi's are going to wreck our relationship over a stern hand in Iraq, then you have a very, very limited understanding of the relationship...particularly if we are doing it to control an Iranian inspired insurection. Additionally, most of the world probably would applaude a strong hand in Iraq. Really Gepap! I can hardly stop laughing enough to type! Go accuse somebody who can't so easily figure out that your attempts to put words in people's mouths is only exceeded by you ability to put a foot in yours!

I was far more correct in the past than you about what the Iraq excercise would be like. Why do you think the future will be any different? Have you learned something in the last three years that will mean your ideas about this area will be less off this time around? HUH?

[PLATO]

Originally posted by GePap


I was far more correct in the past than you about what the Iraq excercise would be like. Why do you think the future will be any different? Have you learned something in the last three years that will mean your ideas about this area will be less off this time around? HUH?

Haha. What, exactly, do you remember me predicting?

Perhaps you don't recall that the reasons that I said were justification for war, while including many of the standard ones, were in essence much different than the main stream Apolytoner's?

This has been an exercise in influence denial and influence gathering in the region. If you will review our threads from before the fighting started, I believe that you will see that it was indeed me that was talking about a result that is closer to reality. Although, in all honesty, we both missed terribly.

[Sava]

WE GOTTA KILL THEM TERRIST BASTARDS!

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Sava
WE GOTTA KILL THEM TERRIST BASTARDS!

Hi George!

[Darius871]

Originally posted by GePap
People have a trulyl weird view of US power. The US is paramount in military power because most of the rest of the world has said, OK, whatever, and they do little to actively conuteract it. The US has reach because it has friends. It has friends because it does not act like PLATO think the US could act in Iraq. The day the US acts in Iraq like PLATO think we could is the day other countries decide US bases uin their territory is not comething they care to have, and maybe they should spend 2-3% more of their GNP on the military.

US hegemony is built on the fact that eveyrone accepts it. The day the world decides the US is not a relatively benign hegemon is the day the US is ****ed.

Interestingly enough...

Originally posted by PLATO

As all historical hyperpowers go, so will the US. No one country can maintain dominance forever. While there is currently a multipolar environment emerging, this is only an interim phase. Eventually China will emerge as a superpower. When this happens, the west will once again unite to create a bi-polar world (No pun intended!).

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...31#post1808431

[Geronimo]

Originally posted by Lancer


Geronimo, what did they do when Saddam attacked Iran?

nothing special. Their conduct was indistinguishable from the kurds and arab sunnis.

[Sikander]

Gepap would win more arguments if his langauge wasn't so absolute.

[Vesayen]

Originally posted by Lancer
Iraq has its own forces. Also, we could turn over our duties there to the Turks in exchange for oil. The government of Iraq would back that rather than get hung.

Iraq has no army, well no loyal organized army which would protect the country.


Why the hell the Iranians set off a nuke ON THEIR BORDER?

[Ecthy]

Turn over military duties to Turkey? Science doesn't seem to be the only field Lancer has no clue of.

[Lancer]

There are many, many more Etchy.

Yet, why not? I've heard a few digs like Etchy's here, but no reason why the Turks couldn't take over.

Etchy, what, you didn't like the lump cookies?

[SlowwHand]

Re: Is Iran Picking a Fight?

Originally posted by Lancer
Just watched a report in CBS that Iranians, with their government's involvement, are helping to plant explosive devices like the ones that recently killed 4 US soldiers.

If true, I say we don't get mad, we get them.

Lancer, you crazy man.
You make it sound like the light bulb just went on over your little pumpkin head.

They've BEEN picking a fight, and I agree with you on the needed response.