Third partiers... independants... we've got to vote democrat

[Vesayen]

In the mid term elections and the next presidential.... it does not matter who the hell is running.

Yes, we proud third partiers and independents are disgusted and enraged at the corruption and undemocratic nature of a two party system, that it is inherently unfair and undemocratic…. We know that the democrats are corrupt as hell and the republicans are even worse……

I watched the news a bit today and C-Span…. I am going to go register tomorrow as a democrat. Things are SO BAD that we have to stop the fight for real democracy, we can try to bust the 2 party system later.

Who watched the news today, or talk radio, or c-span? I’ll summarize. Our republican congress introduced a circle jerk bill which does a few things….

A. Nothing-its non binding.
B. Says we will not set a point to pull out of Iraq
C. Congratulates the heros of everyone who has ever done anything in the American government in the last 6 years, including among the named, CIA operatives which were exposed by the Republicans(A whole owned subsidiary of Bush and Co.), veterans who are having their benefits cut repeatedly and first responders who are likewise have had benefits slashed repeatedly.
D. Give the Republicans to say “You either support the president or are a terrorist”
E. Give the Republicans a chance to bash the democrats.

It was so awful that a number of Republicans boycotted congress today and sent statments of their disgusts....

The scandals in the last week….. gah…… the news over the last few weeks has been horrific. I’m not sure what is worse, the 5 hours our president spent in Iraq(unannounced, a supposedly sovereign nation) or the #2 man in the republican party being convicted and resigning….

Things are SO BAD that we can’t pick our fight now. If the fight in your district is between a democrat and a republican, vote democrat, no matter who the third party is. If a third party has a good chance of beating a republican or a democrat, by all means, vote for them. We can not afford it anymore.

We are running up a huge debt.
When has America EVER been hated so much world wide? Ever?
Worst of all the media are silent collaborators to the Republican party and corporate America.
Let’s not forget the 2,500 dead American soldiers in Iraq alone and 18,500 WOUNDED U.S. SOLDIERS(# released by the military).

Congress has COMPLETLEY SOLD OUT the American people.

Things are TOO BAD to keep up the fight to introduce real democracy in America. I am seriously afraid that 4 more years of America under American rule could permanently end American power on the world stage, politically, economically and military.


I await the posts telling me to calm down and calling me insane or a conspiracy nut, so go ahead….. watching c-span today broke my camels back.


Things are bad….. really bad.

[Jaguar]

What did the word "completely" ever do to you?

http://apolyton.net/forums/search.php?s=&action=showresults&searchid=320051&sortby=lastpost&sortorder=descending

[DanS]

Things are bad….. really bad.

Oh puhleeze. How old are you?

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Third partiers... independants... we've got to vote democrat

No we don't. In fact weather report in hell say hot and hotter.

[Lorizael]

Wow, I've never seen Poly's search work so well.

[DanS]

[Blaupanzer]

Thinking men know when to speak out and when to go to ground. The time for speaking out is rapidly ending.

"We need to do something" is an unusually forlorn cry. Who do you think elected all those Bozos. "We" did. Even if you didn't vote for them, the process appears to have been followed. However, the process may be being coopted (Florida 2000, Ohio 2004). If that does happen, then voting won't matter. In the meantime, most Dems are not that far from most Repubs.

So cut the panic, find a candidate you really believe in, and try to do something constructive before it really is too late.

[Vesayen]

Originally posted by DanS


Oh puhleeze. How old are you?

21.

I didn't say this is the worst it has ever been in America, did I?

Originally posted by Blaupanzer
Thinking men know when to speak out and when to go to ground. The time for speaking out is rapidly ending.

"We need to do something" is an unusually forlorn cry. Who do you think elected all those Bozos. "We" did. Even if you didn't vote for them, the process appears to have been followed. However, the process may be being coopted (Florida 2000, Ohio 2004). If that does happen, then voting won't matter. In the meantime, most Dems are not that far from most Repubs.

So cut the panic, find a candidate you really believe in, and try to do something constructive before it really is too late.

I did something. I am trying to appeal to other third party followers and independants to vote democrat.

[RGBVideo]

What kind of an idiot ever votes for a third party in first-past the post electoral system with open primaries, anyway? If you want to change your representatives, you can do it in the primaries. I mean, of course it makes more sense than not voting, but only marginally: Your vote won't matter in the actual election result, it only raises the awareness of the party you voted for, so they'd have better chances in the next election and it of course gives them moral support. I'd only do it if I thought that the winner of the election I'm voting in is already crystal clear so my vote hasn't got any chances of deciding the election anyway.

Vesayen, are you one of the guys who voted for a third party in 2004 "out of principle" or because "it would send a message" since "both of the candidates are the same, anyway"?

[Vesayen]

No, in 2004 I voted democrat-knowing full well Kerry is acorrupt *bleep*, but an improvment over Bush.

Both of the canidates were not the same. I empathized alot with people who said that, but I was informed.

[RGBVideo]

Good to hear. Not because I'm a big fan of Kerry, but because I was concerned about your sanity.

And things are bad, but not because of any of those things which you mentioned (great job convincing moderates like Lancer, Albert Speer and Shi Huangdi which the democrats need to win this election with your tinfoil-hat communist rhetoric, btw. "the media are silent collaborators to the Republican party and corporate America.", ffs kid). Iraq isn't nearly as bad as Vietnam ("2,500 dead" ), the growth based on debt isn't much worse than it was during Reagan, and America isn't loathed as much as the democrats are making you think it is (though Bush is, but mature adults can see the distinction between Bush and the American people).

What's bad for the future of America is the way how the Bush has time and time again ripped the constitution apart and used it's remains as his toilet paper, and how the Congress' Republicans prove that they're nothing but parts of his rubber stamp by looking the other way when they're supposed to punish the executive for the crimes it has committed and admitted. This is a Really Bad Thing because it's causing a bad precedent for future Presidents. Precedent of an "unitary executive", as Bush's supreme court appointments are putting it right now, an executive branch of government which can do whatever the **** it wants, where-ever the **** it wants, whenever the **** it wants. In English, an elected dictator without any concerns of limitations of power or the law of the land.

But the democrats in Congress have more important concerns to whine about, like taxes which should be raised ("but hey, only for the rich!"), the way how President is bad because "he possibly mislead us about the war", and now also how it is "racist" to demand people to learn English before moving to USA. Morons. I wonder how big they'll lose this time.

[Datajack Franit]

independants

[RGBVideo]

Originally posted by Datajack Franit
independants

Nope, independants are smart, for them politics is about rational decisions instead of emotions and prejudices. What I was critical of was people who vote for independents who have no chance of affecting the election whatsoever.

What's really disturbing is that some people are stupid enough to vote for obviously corrupt, incompetent liars like Berlusconi just because he loudly labels his opponents communists dreaming from the days of Stalin...

[Vesayen]

Originally posted by VJ
"the media are silent collaborators to the Republican party and corporate America.", ffs kid

Its true. It is not an active conspiracy but it is in the best short term interest of all major media outlets to give the Republicans a pass and ignore major news issues. Why? Politics is complex. The news never talks about complicated issues. Its boring. Boring news does not get money-so real political issues are ignored. How many scandals has the media given Bush and Co. a pass on? The fact that the major phone companies in the U.S. handed over information of the length of every phone conversation for years should of been a source of *MAJOR* outrage. No one cared, the media quickly forgot it.

Fox News is obviously in an active conspiracy with the Republican party.

Originally posted by VJ
Iraq isn't nearly as bad as Vietnam ("2,500 dead" ),

Never said it was. Iraq is not vietnam, its not really even a good comparison.

Originally posted by VJ
the growth based on debt isn't much worse than it was during Reagan

Source? If you want to start a new thread on this, please do... i've hit the 2 thread cap, i'd like to discuss this at length without thread jacking this one.

Originally posted by VJ
America isn't loathed as much as the democrats are making you think it is (though Bush is, but mature adults can see the distinction between Bush and the American people).

As the democrats make me think? Who ever said it was the democrats making me think that lol? I think it based on my anecdotal contact with people all over the world and international media sources which seem to show enormous dislike towards the U.S. even in nations we are traditionally allied with.

How many south American nations are now activley working against us? How many of our old friends in Europe now oppose us?



I wish I brought up the sham that Bush has done with the supreme court.

I didn't mention the worst stuff, I mentioned some of the more recent stuff that came to mind.

Originally posted by VJ
What's bad for the future of America is the way how the Bush has time and time again ripped the constitution apart and used it's remains as his toilet paper, and how the Congress' Republicans prove that they're nothing but parts of his rubber stamp by looking the other way when they're supposed to punish the executive for the crimes it has committed and admitted. This is a Really Bad Thing because it's causing a bad precedent for future Presidents. Precedent of an "unitary executive", as Bush's supreme court appointments are putting it right now, an executive branch of government which can do whatever the **** it wants, where-ever the **** it wants, whenever the **** it wants. In English, an elected dictator without any concerns of limitations of power or the law of the land.

Give the man a cookie! DING DING DING! I agree 110%. Of all the harm Bush has done to America, the worst he has done is to tear respect for the constitution to shreads. *THIS* is why we need to get rid of the Republican majority in congress, they showed they were willing to sit by and let the constitution be shat on.

Originally posted by VJ
But the democrats in Congress have more important concerns to whine about, like taxes which should be raised ("but hey, only for the rich!"), the way how President is bad because "he possibly mislead us about the war", and now also how it is "racist" to demand people to learn English before moving to USA. Morons. I wonder how big they'll lose this time.

The only effective means for the democrats to talk to the people is on stupid, knee jerk reaction issues. Why? Because the news ignores complicated issues. What else do you want the democrats to do?

The democrats are not saying the taxes should be raised on the rich, they are saying we shouldn't get rid of taxes on the rich and destroy the noble class, which is something most of America would agree with, if they knew it was even being said.

[Datajack Franit]

I was pointing at the grammar, you finnish capushnik