The CIA was able to keep their prisons secret for decades....

[BlackCat]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


So the Holocaust was okay!

Well, I guess that if it was yanks that had done it, it would have been ok, but since it was foreigners, then it of course wasn't ok.

[Darius871]

Originally posted by Vesayen
we have not gotten ANY useful or productive results out of the crap we have been doing. Why in GODS name we have done the crap we have done in Iraq or in Cuba when we have NO results is beyond me.....

How do you know we got no useful results whatsoever? What security clearance do you have?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by BlackCat


Well, I guess that if it was yanks that had done it, it would have been ok, but since it was foreigners, then it of course wasn't ok.

Oh, right.

[BlackCat]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Oh, right.

Nah, don't be so shy - as Vesayen has stated you have the right to do it because you take this right

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=152583&pagenumber=2

postin #33 or so.

Btw. How are the stormsecurity - are we going to hear that you are blown to sea or have you steady ground under your feet ?

[chequita guevara]

Storm season is still a week away. The big nasties, though, usually don't come until Aug-Oct.

[BlackCat]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Storm season is still a week away. The big nasties, though, usually don't come until Aug-Oct.

Yeah, but since Bush got reelected, I guess that you are in for worse than previously experienced - revenge of nature etc

It was more in the line that here we learn from storms and improve protection - do you still say it won't happen again and bang up last minute protection when it after all happens one more time ?

[Zkribbler]

As a piece of historical irony.

During our Revolutionary War, the Brits refused to treat captured Yankees as prisoners of war because they were combantants from no recognized country.

[DRoseDARs]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

If it is truly the will of the people that the above be the way the U.S. does buisness, then congress should sign it into law. Treaties simply do not hold the same legal status in America, or hold the same level of respect that they do in other countries.

Article VI

This Constitution, and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land

God, that's like General Hayden, the 4th Amendment, and his insistance at a press conference that it says NOTHING about "probable cause" and if he is well-versed in any amendments to the US Constitution, he goes on to boast, then it's the 4th Amendment...

Moron.

Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Wait... Hayden actually said that?! Holy ****.

[Ramo]

Yep.

QUESTION: Jonathan Landay with Knight Ridder. I'd like to stay on the same issue, and that had to do with the standard by which you use to target your wiretaps. I'm no lawyer, but my understanding is that the Fourth Amendment of the Constitution specifies that you must have probable cause to be able to do a search that does not violate an American's right against unlawful searches and seizures. Do you use --

GEN. HAYDEN: No, actually -- the Fourth Amendment actually protects all of us against unreasonable search and seizure.

QUESTION: But the --

GEN. HAYDEN: That's what it says.

QUESTION: But the measure is probable cause, I believe.

GEN. HAYDEN: The amendment says unreasonable search and seizure.

QUESTION: But does it not say probable --

GEN. HAYDEN: No. The amendment says --

QUESTION: The court standard, the legal standard --

GEN. HAYDEN: -- unreasonable search and seizure.

QUESTION: The legal standard is probable cause, General. You used the terms just a few minutes ago, "We reasonably believe." And a FISA court, my understanding is, would not give you a warrant if you went before them and say "we reasonably believe"; you have to go to the FISA court, or the attorney general has to go to the FISA court and say, "we have probable cause."

And so what many people believe -- and I'd like you to respond to this -- is that what you've actually done is crafted a detour around the FISA court by creating a new standard of "reasonably believe" in place of probable cause because the FISA court will not give you a warrant based on reasonable belief, you have to show probable cause. Could you respond to that, please?

GEN. HAYDEN: Sure. I didn't craft the authorization. I am responding to a lawful order. All right? The attorney general has averred to the lawfulness of the order.

Just to be very clear -- and believe me, if there's any amendment to the Constitution that employees of the National Security Agency are familiar with, it's the Fourth. And it is a reasonableness standard in the Fourth Amendment. And so what you've raised to me -- and I'm not a lawyer, and don't want to become one -- what you've raised to me is, in terms of quoting the Fourth Amendment, is an issue of the Constitution. The constitutional standard is "reasonable." And we believe -- I am convinced that we are lawful because what it is we're doing is reasonable.

http://www.mediainfo.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002463957

[DRoseDARs]

Everytime I hear someone say that General Hayden is experienced and the right person for the job (new head of the CIA) I die a little more inside...

[Serb]

Re: The CIA was able to keep their prisons secret for decades....

Originally posted by Vesayen
They probably were really doing it for the betterment of America and our interests..... after all, we have to torture communists SOMEWHERE.

The West have a long history of such glorious activities:
*Warning, the article contains some shocking pictures*

http://www.guardian.co.uk/frontpage/story/0,,1745683,00.html

I hope you still having fun. Why the hell not? Those unfortunates were only commies after all, and fully deserved to be tortued to death.

[Arrian]

You want me on that wall. You NEED me on that wall!

**** that. No.

-Arrian

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Zkribbler
During our Revolutionary War, the Brits refused to treat captured Yankees as prisoners of war because they were combantants from no recognized country.

Everybody knows the US is a bunch of terrorists that has territory for its nefarious scheme, and that hass been made possible only because of complacency by legitimate powers (like France), and appeasement by others (Britain).

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by DRoseDARs
Everytime I hear someone say that General Hayden is experienced and the right person for the job (new head of the CIA) I die a little more inside...

Ditto