Death penalty is damn right

[GePap]

Originally posted by SlowwHand


laurentius, you're a jackass.
Take reds4ever with you, and go play in the street. Leave this discussion to the big boys.

So what are you still doing here?

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by Provost Harrison
Death penalty

Remember the purpose of a penal system is to reform, not to avenge.

Actually, the prison system has four purposes:

1. To protect Society from the prisoner
2. To reform the prisoner
3. To punish the prisoner for his actions (the "revenge" factor)
4. Deterrence- to deter others from commiting the crime

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia
how can the state tell the individual that killing is wrong, and then turn around and kill?

State morality is different from individual morality. How can the state tell me that I'm not allowed to imprison someone, and then turn around and imprison people?

[GePap]

The problem I have with most proponents of the modern DP is how they start jumping through moralistic hoops when talking about states like China or SA were the DP is common an applied to a wide variety of crimes, but then talk about how it is still right.

What about China's use of the DP for tax evaders? Do the people who think that the Death penalty is fine approve of China's use of it in this case?

Would the DP supporters here support making the DP the standard punishment for 1st Degree murder? No exemptions, no choosing based on victim, just stating that any and all 1st Degre murder convictions deserve the death penalty?

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by GePap
Would the DP supporters here support making the DP the standard punishment for 1st Degree murder? No exemptions, no choosing based on victim, just stating that any and all 1st Degre murder convictions deserve the death penalty?

I would say yes, so long as the proof standards were high enough. Make the standard for an execution "proof" rather than "beyond a reasonable doubt." The state has the burden to absolutely prove that he did it. No executions for murder convictions based on circumstantial evidence, no executions based solely on eyewitness testimony. I'd require DNA evidence and / or some type of electronic surveillance verifying that the accused actually committed the crime. If convicted, the accused gets one automatic appeal to the state or federal Supreme Court (depending on the jurisdiction in which the murder was committed). If the execution is upheld by the Supreme Court, it is carried out within 30 days.
If this process is satisfied, then I'd support it for any 1st degree murderer.

[Kontiki]

Originally posted by Provost Harrison
Remember the purpose of a penal system is to reform, not to avenge. I know emotions speak loudly in cases like this, and it is truly sickening, but the right thing has to be done. In this case it would be life imprisonment...where life means life...

That doesn't make sense. If you think the only purpose is to reform (which I disagree with, see Wycoff's response), then why would a true life sentence be any better than the death penalty? What's the point of "reforming" someone if they are permanently locked in a cage, with no chance of being let out?

[Mrs. Tuberski]

It has been my experience that most folks dont really care about the DP until it is on their front door step. I.E if the victim or accused is some how related. That changes minds really quick. I for one would think if anyone here were the parents of that child, they would be the first one with the gun in hand to put those murders out of their misery. Whether one agrees with the dp is not the problem, this is about when it becomes your problem and then how do you view it and deal with it.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by GePap
The problem I have with most proponents of the modern DP is how they start jumping through moralistic hoops when talking about states like China or SA were the DP is common an applied to a wide variety of crimes, but then talk about how it is still right.

What about China's use of the DP for tax evaders? Do the people who think that the Death penalty is fine approve of China's use of it in this case?

Would the DP supporters here support making the DP the standard punishment for 1st Degree murder? No exemptions, no choosing based on victim, just stating that any and all 1st Degre murder convictions deserve the death penalty?

No.

What is your point?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Kill 'em both. There are cases where the people do not deserve to live. And no amount of 'reform' can help them.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by alva

Also, not everything decision should be made based on money.
That's something you quite often see when talking to Americans, compared to other nations.

You aren't being serious here, are you?

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Kill 'em both. There are cases where the people do not deserve to live. And no amount of 'reform' can help them.

I'd add to that. There are some cases in which people don't deserve the opportunity to be reformed, like this one. Why should they be afforded that opportunity when they willingly deprived the baby of ever having a chance to do anything with his life?

[germanos]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Kill 'em both. There are cases where the people do not deserve to live. And no amount of 'reform' can help them.

Actually, this case appears to have great prospects for 'reform'. I'm not aware of the motives for the kidnap (infertility by the kidnappers is my guess), and the chances of them running in an accident with an epilectic toddler seems pretty small.
So far it looks more to be a 'panic kill' rather then a deliberate sadistic act.

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by germanos


Actually, this case appears to have great prospects for 'reform'. I'm not aware of the motives for the kidnap (infertility by the kidnappers is my guess), and the chances of them running in an accident with an epilectic toddler seems pretty small.
So far it looks more to be a 'panic kill' rather then a deliberate sadistic act.

..if so, then that activates my corollary. These people don't deserve the chance for reform. Their victim gets no second chance, why should they?

[ajbera]

I say kill 'em. Preferably by caving their heads in with a shovel and throwing them in the river.

But I guess I'm just a "knuckle-dragger."

No CP? Fine. Solitary confinement. For the rest of their lives. Nothing but a bucket. If they behave themselves for ten years, give them a noose to play with.

[SlowwHand]

Originally posted by GePap
The problem I have with most proponents of the modern DP is how they start jumping through moralistic hoops when talking about states like China or SA were the DP is common an applied to a wide variety of crimes, but then talk about how it is still right.

What about China's use of the DP for tax evaders? Do the people who think that the Death penalty is fine approve of China's use of it in this case?

Would the DP supporters here support making the DP the standard punishment for 1st Degree murder? No exemptions, no choosing based on victim, just stating that any and all 1st Degre murder convictions deserve the death penalty?

It's an option, just as has been said repeatedly.

We could save further money and let you ridiculous them to death.