Is the US substantially "freer" than most of Western Europe?

[Ecthy]

Obviously that country was founded a sanctuary of freedom when Europe was still full of absolute monarchies and the like, Britain being the sole exception (Poland died quickly and so did the revolution in France). Until today Americans seem to understand their own country as the freest place on Earth. In some nearby thread SlowwHand expressd his very understanding of the US itself as a place where personal freedom is valued.

But is that still true? I'm not going to troll anyone and talk about Patriot Act or stuff. But if you look at the progress that most Europe has made, and Western Europe in particular, you'll find there are some damn free places there. All this trash talk about how you can go wherever you want and breathe freely and stuff, you can do that here. Not in Russia though.

Beyond the liberal gun ownership legislature, how would the United States of today be any freer than Europe?

[Spiffor]

Banana: the US and western Europe are roughly equivalent when it comes to freedoms, but it's not the US who taught Europe what freedom is. The American tradition of liberalism originates in Britain, and the continental tradition of liberalism mostly originates in the French enlightenment. The US did permit western Europe to have freedom again (after defeating the nazis and protecting us from the Soviets), but they didn't contribute much to the ideas about freedom, which had already been there for more than a century.

[Sandman]

About the same. However, the US has a worrying number of dubious 'agencies' - what do the NSA and/or the Department of Homeland Security actually do?

Also: I don't agree with Spiffor's two liberalisms.

[Sava]

until I can roll down the street smoking indo, sippin' on gin and juice...

NONE OF US ARE FREE

[SlowwHand]

Europe is quite free, too. After the US told us how to do it.

Some places, like Amsterdam, learned the lesson almost to excess.

[Harry Tuttle]

Hmmmm, well how about the gun laws and speech laws in Britain? Aren't they more stringent than the U.S.?

[Pekka]

The same. It has some .. differencies as in there are Euro countries you can smoke weed and all that and go to prossies and have fun, and in Texas you can carry a bazooka going to a bar so there are some differencies but all in all it weights about the same IMO.

[Provost Harrison]

it's easy to argue that carrying weapons are not an integral part of freedom.

[germanos]

I can't vote on the poll as none of the options reflects my position.

The OP is full of symplifications as well, probably to fit the limited choices.

The Netherlands were one of the few free places in a Europe full of absulute Morachies and princedoms when the US was founded. It's no coincidence the Mayflower sailed from Delfshaven, a few hundred meters from where I live. Holland was the first stage in their quest for freedom, the USA the second.

At the moment, Europe (EU) and Northern America are probably equally free. Both have some limitations on personal liberties where the other has not.

I certainly don't view the US as more free then the Netherlands/EU, but especially in the immigration policies, the USA has a far more liberal view then the Netherlands/EU.

[alva]

Originally posted by Provost Harrison
it's easy to argue that carrying weapons are not an integral part of freedom.

Agreed.
How free are you when you need a gun to protect it.

[Provost Harrison]

It's actually one of those debates that I am wholly indifferent about, I certainly don't feel it's an integral part of civil liberties...

[DinoDoc]

In areas of free speech, we most certainly are freer than Europe.

[DanS]

Agree with Dino. Although to be fair, Europe is not monolithic in this regard.

[Provost Harrison]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
In areas of free speech, we most certainly are freer than Europe.

Justify yourself...

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Provost Harrison
Justify yourself...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4733820.stm