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  • Originally posted by germanos


    The Russian rapists didn't care for nationality. They raped at will when they 'liberated' Ravensbrück, a concentration-camp for female political prisoners. Needles to say a good chunk of the prisoners were communists. They were not spared.

    Probably they raped Polish, Czech, Slovak women etc. in their villages as well. I would be quite surprised if the rapes only took place in Germany itself.
    The bigger the lie, the sooner they believe it.

    Probably your name is Dr. Guebels.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Vince278
      Now, has anyone ever wondered why Soviet losses were disproportionately much higher than anyone else's?
      Because in comparison with war on Eastern front, the rest was a slide show. This is where Nazis commited bulk of their forces and lost 3/4 of its personel. The Eastern front was the place where major forces from both sides fought and dying.

      And it is not so disproportionately if you are talking about combat losses. Soviet demographic losses due to WW2 = 26.6 millions people. Only 8.6 millions among them were military personel. The rest 18 millions were civilians.

      Irretrievable losses (combat, non-combat, POW) of Red Army during the GPW were 11.4 million, including 4.55 million POWs. Only 1.8 out of 4.55 million Soviet POWs surrvived (40%). Total demographic losses (who actually died) = 8.6 million.

      Irretrievable losses (combat, non-combat, POW) of Wehrmacht and its allies at Eastern front were 8.6 million, including 3.48 million POWs. Among those 3.48 million POWS 2.96 million survived and came back home after the war (85%). Total demographic losses = 5.1 million.

      8.6 vs 5.1 it's a comparable ratio, if you ask me:
      1:1,6 in AXIS favor.

      Futhermore, had Soviets treated their POWs like Nazis did (only 40% survived). The number would be even more similar:
      (3.48/100)*40= 1.392 million survivors (insted of 2.96 million)
      5.1 + (2.96-1.392) = 6.668

      So, that would be 1:1.28 in AXIS favor.

      As for civilian losses, I am sure had Germany been an arena for intensive ground combat for over three years and had Soviets treated local population like Nazis did, then civilian losses there would be close to 18 millions too.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Vince278
        Targeting civilians were allowed in WW2.


        The rape of women was allowed by the Soviets. Does that make it not a war crime? The deliberate targetting of (Western) civilians has been a war crime in the West for hundreds of years. We're not talking about civilians dying on train or in a factory. We're talking about the deliberate annihilation of whole cities.

        You are trying to have a double standard where it is okay for us in the West to deliberately murder hundreds of thousands of civilians in their homes and schools, but where rape and murder by the Soviet troops (not necessarily a deliberate strategy) is not okay.

        You cannot have it both ways. Either both are crimes or neither are crimes.

        And you are completely wrong about the deliberate killing of civilians not being a war crime.
        Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

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        • Originally posted by germanos
          The Russian rapists didn't care for nationality. They raped at will when they 'liberated' Ravensbrück, a concentration-camp for female political prisoners. Needles to say a good chunk of the prisoners were communists. They were not spared.
          Somehow I doubt that.

          From Wiki, no mention of rapes:
          Ravensbrück had a gas chamber and crematorium, and at the end of 1944 it became a death camp. With the Soviet Army's rapid approach in the Spring of 1945, the SS decided to exterminate as many prisoners as they could in order to avoid leaving anyone to testify as to what had happened in the camp. With the Russians only hours away, at the end of April, the SS ordered the women still physically well enough to walk to leave the camp. Less than 2,000 malnourished and sickly women and 300 men remained in the camp when it was liberated by the Red Army on April 30, 1945. The survivors of the Death March were liberated in the following hours by a Russian scout unit. By the time liberation came, tens of thousands (estimates are about 30,000 to 40,000) of women and children had perished there.
          Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Serb

            Actually it’s my proof that you want us dead, but still lacks the balls to fulfill your plans.
            We disbanded the Warsaw Pact, switched our ideology and accepted democracy, but no, - NATO still exist. Even more, it is growing. You keep surrounding our country with your military bases. If you are so ****ing peacefull, why do you keep increasing your military might at our borders? WHY THE HELL NATO still exist, if Warsaw Pact perished a decade ago?
            There is only one answer – you hate us regardless of our ideology economic or political system. You just hate us, because we are Russians. And you will keep surrounding us with your bases untill the moment when you think you can safely destroy us. And the weaker we will be, the sooner this moment will come. Just be honest and admit that.
            Currently Russia exist thanks to its nuclear potential, but when you will find the way to neutralize it, for you Russia will become just another Yougoslavia, Afghanistan or Iraq. In 1945 USSR didn’t have nukes, while you, except A-bombs, had hordes of strategic bombers. There were only few problems for you: you didn’t have enough nukes, yet; you couldn’t deliver them to core Soviet territory; Red Army was very strong.
            In case if in Poland or Romania were stantioned your strategic bombers with nuclear pay load, insted of Soviet intercepters, you would destroy us, no doubt. We had no luxury of allowing that happen. It was a matter of survival for us, simple as that.
            NATO is really quite simple in practical terms. An attack on one member is an attack on all of the members. Even if Russia did not exist why would NATO members want to disband their organization? Collective defense doesn't have much of a downside.

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            • Not to mention that a democratic, reformed Russia will eventually be welcomed into NATO, most likely.
              (\__/)
              (='.'=)
              (")_(") This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination.

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              • Anyone mentioned Dresden yet?
                You just wasted six ... no, seven ... seconds of your life reading this sentence.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by notyoueither
                  Not to mention that a democratic, reformed Russia will eventually be welcomed into NATO, most likely.
                  No.

                  Originally posted by Krill
                  Anyone mentioned Dresden yet?
                  Several times. Apparently because we did it, it's okay. It's only bad if our enemies do something.
                  Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

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                  • Originally posted by chegitz guevara


                    No.
                    Why on earth do you oppose russian membership in NATO?

                    Comment


                    • I don't, NATO does. The purpose of NATO is to ensure American domination of the globe, always has been. I don't see how Russia could ever be reconciled to that.
                      Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by MrFun



                        The idea behind bombing cities was not to kill civilians -- civilian deaths unfortunately are often the result.

                        What Russians did to civilian women though, they carried out with the intent to rape and kill them.
                        That's the silliest moral reasoning there is: 'Oh, we just killed 100,000 civilians, but since we didn't really intend it, it's fine.'
                        In Soviet Russia, Fake borises YOU.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by chegitz guevara
                          I don't, NATO does. The purpose of NATO is to ensure American domination of the globe, always has been. I don't see how Russia could ever be reconciled to that.
                          Hehe.
                          (\__/)
                          (='.'=)
                          (")_(") This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by chegitz guevara
                            I don't, NATO does. The purpose of NATO is to ensure American domination of the globe, always has been. I don't see how Russia could ever be reconciled to that.
                            why isn't it structured so as to facillitate that then? Why wasn't the invasion of Iraq a NATO operation if as you say NATOs purpose is to ensure american domination?

                            Rather curious for an organization designed to ensure a countries domination to not side with that country when it launches a war. NATO in fact is a treaty organization. Every detail of it's existance is defined by various documents. What you see is what you get, and if you look at the documents you don't find an organization designed to ensure American Domination, rather you simply find a collective defense organization.

                            check wiki to reacquaint yourself with the basics of NATO

                            Comment


                            • You have to remember our current government is especially incompetent.

                              As for Wiki, I know what the stated purpose of NATO is. But the actual purpose was rather different.
                              Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by chegitz guevara
                                You have to remember our current government is especially incompetent.

                                As for Wiki, I know what the stated purpose of NATO is. But the actual purpose was rather different.
                                if by "actual" purpose you mean some undocumented secret purpose of the organization then who cares about "actual" purposes? The stated purpose is the one that is actually set out in black in white in the treaties, and if you look at the decision making structure of NATO there really isn't any room to use the organization to pursue such "actual" purposes in a way that would trump the stated purpose.

                                Again in no way is NATO designed in a manner even remotely conducive to secretly facilitating one members domination of the world. That was simply not it's purpose.

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