Abortion!

[joncha]

Originally posted by DRoseDARs
How so? Read my response to BK in his Alito thread. Until certain underlying problems are addressed, banning abortion outside of rape, incest, or the health of the mother or child is a baaad idea.

And not banning it implies giving the mother a choice. Hence the name of the position.

[Japher]

Is preventing life any worse then killing one?

If you know someone is going to kill someone and do nothing you can be tried as an accomplice to murder.

If you witness a crime and do nothing you can be tried for something I'm sure.

I think that once an egg is fertilized anything that is done to prevent that egg from getting it's fair shake at becoming a life is wrong.

I use to be pro-choice. However, I am coming more and more to the side that the "choice" should be made before the conception.

[Arrian]

However, I am coming more and more to the side that the "choice" should be made before the conception.

Pro-choicers really ought to focus on sex ed and contraception. The fact is that if the public is well-educated and have reasonable access to birth control, the number of unwanted pregnancies would drop precipitously, as would the resulting abortions.

Focus on prevention of unwanted pregnancies. Many Americans (I have no numbers here, it's true) oppose abortion in whole or in part because they believe people are using it as alternative birth control, which offends their sense of morality (personal responsibility)... and frankly, I'm with them there.

If, however, abortions pretty much only happened b/c of rape/incest or a failure of birth control (rare, if used properly, but still possible), public support would be more firmly on the side of legalized abortion. Meanwhile, the religionistas would be forced into fighting against sex-ed & contraception. In most of the country, they would be swimming against the tide.

-Arrian

[Japher]

That's true Arrian

I am also for the use of birth control, so I see your point.

A seed is still a seed, it just doesn't start growing until planted. I don't see what the problem is not planting it until you want to, but still throwing it around a bit.

AS a side note, it is said that for bulb plants you should store them in a cold dark place (in a bag in the back of the fridge) for a certain amount of time before planting.

[Arrian]

By the way, I've pretty much always thought that education/birth control was the way out of the current disaster of a debate on abortion in this country, but it was an article on Slate that got me fired up about it this morning.

Japher... dude, sometimes you're very strange. Thanks for the agricultural advice.

-Arrian

[Japher]

I think it's only a couple of weeks, but they can be stored for up to a year. So long as that place is also dry. I had some get mold.

[Japher]

I use to think it was the Catholic faith that cause many unwanted pregnancy until someone pointed out that Italy is having a decrease in population because all the men would rather stay home with mom than to have sex with Monica Belluci. Sad really.

I wonder what it is about American societies that cause kids to have no sense of responsibility.

[Ming]

The pro choice option is really the only way to go.

People who are against abortion for any reason can practice what they preach. Pro choice is just that... a choice, which can be dictated by a person's personal beliefs. Nobody is trying to tell them they have to abortions... it's just a matter of letting people make up their own minds.

The No Abortion postion is not a choice. It is one person cramming their views down somebody else's throat.

It should be left up to the individuals involved...

[Jon Miller]

How teh **** can killing people be the only way to go?

How is killing a 'choice'? Especially when no one asks the one being killed.

If there is brainwaves than there is seperate (independent life). If that life has the DNA of a human it is human.

When is the child being allowed to make up it's mind? I think that abortion is the worst crime against humanity to ever be done.

Jon Miller

[Arrian]

If you think that human life begins at conception, which many (most?) of us do not, then your position makes sense, Jon.

But I don't see it that way.

By the way, are you going to be adopting?

-Arrian

[Ming]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
How teh **** can killing people be the only way to go?

How is killing a 'choice'? Especially when no one asks the one being killed.

If there is brainwaves than there is seperate (independent life). If that life has the DNA of a human it is human.

When is the child being allowed to make up it's mind? I think that abortion is the worst crime against humanity to ever be done.

Jon Miller

And that is your opinion, and you are welcome to it. But some people don't see it the same way. When does life really begin???? There will never be agreement on that.
While you see it as murder or killing, others don't. Who is right and who is wrong?

Pro Choice respects the right of personal beliefs.
I respect your belief... but you seem to want to cram your belief down others people's throats...

[Arrian]

Unfortunately, if you really believe it's murder... you kinda HAVE to get fired up about it and try to stop it, don't you?

-Arrian

[Ming]

And if you don't believe it's murder... and you believe it is a personal right for a woman to have control over her own body, you kinda have to get fired up about it too.

[Arrian]

Right. And given that the two sides appear to be pretty evenly matched (depending on the poll and the exact questions asked of the participants), perhaps it's best to focus on the root problem (unwanted pregnancies) and table the abortion issue for a bit.

-Arrian

[Japher]

if you believe a person has a right to have control over their own body than why is suicide illegal?