Dreaming of a (Secular) Christmas

[chequita guevara]

Near my city, some smurfy Xian is going on a crusade about how she's oppressed because a local Jewish Suburb won't let her put up "Reclaim America for Christ" on public property.

http://www.miaminewtimes.com/issues/2005-12-08/news/metro.html

[Az]

Reclaim America for Ganesh!
:elephant:

[Starchild]

Claim America for the Starchild!
:star:

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Near my city, some smurfy Xian is going on a crusade about how she's oppressed because a local Jewish Suburb won't let her put up "Reclaim America for Christ" on public property.

From your link: That holiday season the town, which boasts a substantial Jewish population, decorated its lampposts with eight-foot-high Stars of David. And just east of the tollbooths on Broad Causeway Island, it erected the giant menorah, which had been donated by the Shul of Bal Harbour synagogue.

....

"We felt displaying the manger scene on government land would be a violation of the constitutional separation between church and state," Simone explains.

[Az]

Yeah, that's ****ing bizzare.

Reclaim America for Moses, I guess.

[DinoDoc]

I'm glad I wasn't the only one to find that wierd.

[Theben]

There was a war declared on a religious holiday and I wasn't told?

[Sikander]

Originally posted by beingofone
I have to agree that we should restrict ALL religious ideas from each other. It could destroy the fabric of civilization itself.

I have been traumatized for most of my life by the names of the days in the week. Sunday through Saturday each day named after some ancient god. It offends me deeply and I am unable to function in a society that refers to the days of the week and months as oppressive and intolerant of other religious views.

Join me in a crusade to rid the world of this narrow minded attempt to turn us all into victims of the establishing of religion by and through the names of days and months.

We shall not rest until we are all FREE FROM OPPRESSION. Do away with the names of days and months now. I deserve freedom to not refer to - dare I say it?
AHHHH - MOONDAY - what horror.
You will never know how hard that was to type.

May Tiw's curse lie forever upon you, monotheist!

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
From your link: ...yada yada yada ...

I ain't sayin' the town acted properly, but after this lady won, she then tried to undermine the compromise. "Reclaim America for Christ!?!?" That smurf wouldn't be allowed anywhere.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
I ain't sayin' the town acted properly, but after this lady won, she then tried to undermine the compromise.

Compromise?
So on October 10 it passed a resolution limiting each resident to one display of no more than twelve-by-fifteen feet and barring anyone from entering Broad Causeway Island to "gather or perform services."

...

Snowden chafed at the resolution, particularly the ceremony ban, since the Shul had been performing menorah-lighting rites on Broad Causeway Island for years.


It seems that the town was still being bizzare. Is it really suprising that a wierd town might have wierd citizens?

[Berzerker]

"We felt displaying the manger scene on government land would be a violation of the constitutional separation between church and state," Simone explains.

there must be a law before any establishment even enters the picture and once there is a law, establishment means the law "asks" us to act in accordance with the law. The Pledge of Allegiance is a law that "asks" children to profess an allegiance to the god of the state. A manger scene is not a law and doesn't "ask" anyone to do anything, nor do the 10 Commandments sitting in the rotunda of a court. This is why "The War on Christmas" has legs, because this sh*t happens and people wonder why the traditions they've practiced there whole lives are being swept off "public" property.

[chequita guevara]

A manger scene espouses a particular religion. Thus, the government can't do it. With all the private friggan property available, can't all these religionistas leave public property alone?

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
what Irving Berlin and others like him did may have been good for the war effort, for corporate types being relocated, for secular gentiles, for winter solstice pagans, and even for their own personal efforts to assimilate.

But I daresay it wasnt good for the Jews who dont want to assimilate, including, BTW, reform Jews, despite Myersons lame joke (which hasnt been true for decades, BTW) A genuine religious Christmas is clearly THEIR holiday, which we can ignore, as we largely ignore Easter, etc. A secular holiday we can either indulge in, and so lose our identity, which is incompatable with even a secularist honoring of the birth of Christ (and is not made more compatible by the paganizing of the holidy, whether ancient solstice paganism, or modern shopping mall paganism) or which we can reject, thus appearing to be scrooges, denying the secular joy of the season. Berlin et al, thus created the "December dillema" - and so were largely responsible for the inflation/transformation of Hanukkah.

Of course Myerson, who, AFAICT, has no particular interest in any substantive Jewishness (whether religious or secular Zionist) to the point where hes not even aware of the revival of Jewish identity among Reform Jews, is not concerned with this.

I would much rather see Christmas become MORE religious, less connected to the public square, let Hanukkah recede to its rightful place in the Jewish Calendar, and see Sukkus and Shavous revived. (This last is in our power, and is happening to some extent).
Pagans can and should celebrate the winter solstice in full wiccan ceremonial. You "secular Christians" who want to keep celebrating your feast of Santa can of course continue to do so - its a free country after all - but I dont see that you need to impose it on the rest of us.

LotM secretly is Michael Medved.

[chequita guevara]

Just like I've always said.

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Originally posted by lord of the mark



Here in G-ds country one gets Kosher Turkeys for Thanksgiving. Buying Kosher Turkeys for "Yule"? Silly English Jews. But each to his own goo, i suppose.

I still like Chinese food on Christmas.

TBS was playing "Christmas Story" non stop for 24 hours.

Deck the harrs with bows of horry!! Fa-ra-ra-ra Ra-ra-rar!!

You'll shoot your eye out kid!