German Ignorance

[Dauphin]

The Brits invented concentration camps.[/Ned]

Although he would be right.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Locutus
Yes, because napalming 4 million civilians is a very civilized thing to do

Obviously it's not even on the same level as the Holocaust, but you said she was a high-schooler? 15-16 maybe? Can we really expect her to know the difference? If she was a well-educated grown-up maybe... and as others have said, Germans are very well educated in this respect.

Either way, the Holocaust was the darkest hour in the history of mankind and Vietnam or any other war doesn't compare, there's no doubt about that. But that doesn't mean make every other war the epithomy of all that is good and right. The Americans did commit horrors in Vietnams, just because the Holocaust was worse doesn't make that any less true. Americans ought to be ashamed of what their countrymen did in Vietnam, just as the Germans should be ashamed of WWII, and as the Vietnamese should for their countrymen (and as such pretty much every nation has something to be ashamed of -- I feel I'm more a citizen of the world or Europe than of the Netherlands, but I feel deeply, deeply, deeply ashamed of how my fellow countrymen stood by and did nothing -- and in a way even assisted -- the Serbs during the massacre of Screbrenica, for one thing).

But in reality the only thing many Americans are ashamed of with regard to Vietnam is the fact that they lost

When Americans talk about the causualties of that war, they always talk about the 59,000 Americans that died, but I rarely catch anyone talking about the 3-4 million Vietnamese civilian casualties. I also find it extremely disturbing how Americans in Vietnam are usually depicted as heroes and the good guys. The line "I love the smell of napalm in the morning" is generally regarded as a great movie line (even voted best line in the history of cinema according to one poll) and frequently paraphrased in all sorts of context as a heroic thing to say -- how differently would we react if someone would say "I love the smell of Zyklon B in the morning"...

The Germans generally deal with the horrors of their ancestors in a very mature and responsible way, it's an integral part of their education. That is much more than what can be said of the Americans -- that's one point where that kid isn't completely wrong...

excellent post

[BeBMan]

Re: German Ignorance

Originally posted by Muad'Dib


So America's involvement in Vietnam is comparable to what the Germans did in WW2. Whow!!!! So this is what they're being taught today.

This is certainly not what is taught here.

[Muad'Dib]

Jesus H MFing Christ

The Americans did commit horrors in Vietnams

A couple of isolated incidents, and the perps got what they deserved.
But what a handful of American assh*les did does not even compare, or should be mentioned in the same sentence, to the institutionalized butchery that was standard operational procedure by the Germans.

Get your facts straight, and head out of your ass Locutus.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Muad'Dib
Jesus H MFing Christ



A couple of isolated incidents,

A couple of isolated incidents!?!?



The Vietnamese in the village of My Lai certainly did not deserve what they got.

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Muad'Dib
Jesus H MFing Christ

But what a handful of American assh*les did does not even compare

Now, who was it that started a thread which judged the entire society of a country, based on a single statement from a child?

[Muad'Dib]

As to you, Mr. Fun.

It's called collaterial damage. Stick a SAM site next to a school, and yeah, kids will die. The enemy always tries to weaken your resolve in war thinking that you don't have the balls. But the enemy always gets it wrong.

Americans go out of their way to avoid targeting civilians, to the detriment of our own troops. But when you face an enemy, especially fanactical ones, that cares not for the value of human life and that of their own people. What are you going to do, fight with your hands tied. Because that is exactly what the enemy wants you to do.

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Muad'Dib

But when you face an enemy, especially fanactical ones, that cares not for the value of human life and that of their own people. What are you going to do, fight with your hands tied. Because that is exactly what the enemy wants you to do.

Are you talking about the vietnamese or the americans, now?

[Spiffor]

This thread is a monument to bigotry

It has greatly improved my opinion of nationalists

[Muad'Dib]

Ludd, may we never, ever, meet.

[Locutus]

Originally posted by Muad'Dib
A couple of isolated incidents, and the perps got what they deserved.

4 million dead from isolated incidents? How incredibly thick-headed must one be to actually believe such a thing...

Sorry, Vietnam was nothing short of a massacre. Not the systematic massacre and holocaust that WWII was, but a massacre nonetheless. More bombs were dropped by the Americans during Vietnam than by all participants during WWII. How on earth can you explain that as isolated incidents? And just what the hell did each and every one of those 3-4 million civilians (that's not counting the combatants -- another 500k North and South Vientamese combatants died sa well) do to deserve to die?

YOU'RE the one who needs to get his facts straight, and face the real world.

Again, I said specifically in my last post that the Holocaust does not NEARLY compare to Vietnam -- you conveniently ignored that. But just because that's the case doesn't mean that Vietnam was a not very bad thing either (to put it mildly). You're an incredible hypocryte to claim that the Germans don't take their atrocities seriously, but at the same time waive away the lesser atrocities (but atrocities nonetheless) of your own countrymen as isolated incidents. You're doing exactly the same thing as that German kid -- while you should know better...

[alva]

Originally posted by Muad'Dib
Jesus H MFing Christ



A couple of isolated incidents, and the perps got what they deserved.
But what a handful of American assh*les did does not even compare, or should be mentioned in the same sentence, to the institutionalized butchery that was standard operational procedure by the Germans.

Get your facts straight, and head out of your ass Locutus.

Wow, and you're calling that German kid ignorant???

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Muad'Dib
Ludd, may we never, ever, meet.

Agreed, I like to keep my distance from raving fanatics - especially fascists ones.

[Spiffor]

Locutus

Except for this:

You're doing exactly the same thing as that German kid

Muad' dib is doing worse than this German highschooler. The German highschooler did not whitewash the holocaust nearly as much as what Muad'dib is doing with Vietnam.

[alva]

.