“Cows look calm, but really they are gay nymphomaniacs"

[JimmyCracksCorn]

Originally posted by Odin
Kuci is stuck in the Platonic,Typological, Essentialist, Cartesian, BS view of human self-awareness and consciousness.

F*ck you Plato for putting a strangle-hold on science with typological thinking.

Its understandable, he's still in High School. In HS they teach you things in the most sweeping, broad, generalizing manner possible. Its no surprise that HS kids also happen to be some of the most arrogant, know-it-all ****** around.

Once he gets to University he will, like we all did, realize that nothing is ever as simple as 1+1=2.

[Kuciwalker]

[Whaleboy]

Actually, it works on the presumption that it's an emergent property of matter - so all that matters is the configuration. Now, if it weren't for the fact that I have what I consider direct evidence of self-awareness from OTHER humans, too (they came up with it before me, so it's highly likely they actually were self-aware), then I wouldn't say that other humans' brains are necessarily sufficiently similar. But I do so I do.

An emergent property, but then other’s consciousnesses would be knowable, at least in the sense that we use it. That it could be a logical singularity emerging from the brain, yes that would seem self-evident and neuroscience bears us out there but if you cannot get around the singularity issue, then any attempt at direct knowability is flawed. I do not accept that others have described “self-awareness” is satisfactory, that presumes that language is objective, your perception of it also since you have no guarantee that you mean the same by “self awareness” as everyone else, or at least perceive it thus. Consider this:

I have a rather gay pink beaker on my desk that was filled with strawberry milkshake and chopped bananas before I downed it in the mistaken belief that it contained some kind of biblical elixir. I see it as pink, but how can I know that you see it in the same way? For sure we can subject each other to colour-blindness tests and confirm that pink is a hybrid of red and white, but then we have to talk about those colours, and if we establish that there are no ocular differences between us, we have to conclude that our perception of colour in that respect is a fundamental and incommunicable constant of consciousness, since it is implausible to communicate colour as we experience it in any way to each other. This ignores the idea of shared consciousness but that somewhat defeats the point no? You recall our old debates about internally consistent logical systems? Well 2+2=4, and that can’t be changed in this ICLS, but that does not refute the possibility of another independent ICLS where 2+2=5. We can establish no evidence pro or no for that but then we are subjective. Similar situation exists here… indeed one might say that the consciousness is a singularity: an ICLS. That we can communicate is solely a result of the fact that we have shared “assumptions” behind our ICLS’s, which is easier to do for continuous systems like ourselves rather than discrete ones like mathematics.

If you accept that the consciousness is a singularity then it by definition refutes any notion of knowing 100% the existence of others, Cartesian doubt therefore holds firm.

As for an emergent property of matter, in the same sense as a cars motion is that of an engine, but it makes consciousness no more essential to neurons as metal is to an engine, as opposed to motion, hence the gap between (for want of better words) epistemology and neuroscience.

Eh, there are a number of key terms there that I don't know. English, please?

Yish! Solipsism is the belief that only oneself exists and that existence is just a mental state. Other versions are more closely related to the Cartesian (as in, of Descartes) cogito ergo sum, that I am the only irrefutably existing consciousness in the universe.

The rest you should know.

Kuci is stuck in the Platonic,Typological, Essentialist, Cartesian, BS view of human self-awareness and consciousness.

F*ck you Plato for putting a strangle-hold on science with typological thinking

If he gets into panpsychism I won’t be amused (if my keyboard is conscious I don’t even want to think about the abuses I’ve put it through!

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker
Given how absurd self-awareness is, ...

That is not a given.

[Asmodean]

If anything, this will make me eat even more beef. Crappy, pathetic researchers, with their crappy, pathetic agendas.

DIE COW...so you can be eaten

Asmodean

[Snotty]

Strange things you realize at odd times. I guess Ive got a little bit more of an idea of how casual remarks can be offensive to pro-lifers now. Im just glad Im laid back and not easily offended

[Snotty]

Oops, didnt mean to kill the thread or anything!