French workers fight for the right to be lazy

[alva]

Originally posted by DanS
Has there been a drumbeat from the Belgian business community about Belgium losing global competitiveness?

There has been a very silent request to get back to an 40h/week system but this was more scare-mongering than anything else. Pre-empting salary increase demands etc.
People don't wan to work "that much" anymore and are happy to earn a little less in return.

The biggest problem here is that hiring - and employing someone in general - is way to expensive (taxes).
The gouverment is working on that but it is a slow process.
Don't forget that we have no have no natural resources at all, exceptsome redundant coal. In Civ3 terms, we're ***** big time.

That is unless of-course, being Europe's capital can be seen as a resource.

Also note that is quite a big difference between the north and south...

You haven't been looking some numbers, have you?
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What nobody has mentioned so far in this thread is that for a majority of people, say factory workers for example, it all doesn't matter all that much. Earning 10% more is peanuts and at the end of the month and often it's a zero operation.
If you work more, your costs of living will increase as well. Are you going to cook when you get home at 8.00 or 9.00 am or are you getting some - more expensive - take out etc..

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


He was talking about you, oh ignorant one .

Well duh. And I was talking about you.

This is the story of right wing ideology. Some selfish people see problems that humanity has. They also see that people have sympathy for their fellow humans. The selfish people say to themselves, "This is an opportunity for us." They create an ideology that says that creating benefits for themselves benefits the world. That is how right wing ideologies are created.

The definition of a moderate is someone who is blind to this.

[DanS]

The biggest problem here is that hiring - and employing someone in general - is way to expensive (taxes).

Has it occurred to you that the reason why the taxes are so high is that the government has to squeeze sufficient money out of a low number of work hours? The society's needs don't change, even if the number of work hours does.

If you work more, your costs of living will increase as well. Are you going to cook when you get home at 8.00 or 9.00 am or are you getting some - more expensive - take out etc..

This is true. Everybody spends most of what they make, whatever they make. I would argue that the takeout is a good trade-off that maximizes the skills of everybody involved, however.

[MikeH]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


Hey, you are the one who wants me to get a mini beer fridge .

I don't have one of those myself.

[alva]

Originally posted by DanS


Has it occurred to you that the reason why the taxes are so high is that the government has to squeeze sufficient money out of a low number of work hours? The society's needs don't change, even if the number of work hours does.

Not really, the main reason why taxes are that high, is because we're paying off a huge debt.
They have been lowering taxes for quite some time but like I said...slowly.

Note: that we are one of few Euro countries without a budget deficit in the last 10? years.

PS: I tried looking for some concrete and correct info but to be honest, I couldn't find anything decent.
Maybe Colon could do a far better job than me on this.

[Kidlicious]

Maybe taxes are so high because labor compensation is so low.

[Spiffor]

I would just like to point out that studies have shown, since the intorduction of the 35 hours workweek, that workers have become more efficient per hour, and the average hour of work by a Frenchman is much more than the same hour worked by an American. That's because, thanks to our reasonable schedules, we spend our time at the working doing some actual work. There is far less time spent at the workplace for entertainment (like posting on 'Poly). Such is what we do in our free time.

The 35 hours workweek had no negative impact on our growth, and had a slight but positive impact on our unemployment. The real problem of the French society and economy is unemployment, but repelling the 35 hours workweek won't help it any. It will only worsen our quality of life with extremely little in return. According to polls, about only 20% of the population wishes to work more, which means that repelling the 35 hours workweek will benefit a few and hurt most

[Odin]

Originally posted by Kidicious


Well duh. And I was talking about you.

This is the story of right wing ideology. Some selfish people see problems that humanity has. They also see that people have sympathy for their fellow humans. The selfish people say to themselves, "This is an opportunity for us." They create an ideology that says that creating benefits for themselves benefits the world. That is how right wing ideologies are created.

The definition of a moderate is someone who is blind to this.

Nah, the Capitalists are just victims of the naturalistic fallacy, that is that if greed is part of human nature than greed must be good. Just because something is part of human nature, doesn't mean it is good, otherwise xenophobia would be a good thing.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Odin
the Capitalists are just victims of the naturalistic fallacy

They aren't victims.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Spiffor
I would just like to point out that studies have shown, since the intorduction of the 35 hours workweek, that workers have become more efficient per hour, and the average hour of work by a Frenchman is much more than the same hour worked by an American. That's because, thanks to our reasonable schedules, we spend our time at the working doing some actual work. There is far less time spent at the workplace for entertainment (like posting on 'Poly). Such is what we do in our free time.

The 35 hours workweek had no negative impact on our growth, and had a slight but positive impact on our unemployment. The real problem of the French society and economy is unemployment, but repelling the 35 hours workweek won't help it any. It will only worsen our quality of life with extremely little in return. According to polls, about only 20% of the population wishes to work more, which means that repelling the 35 hours workweek will benefit a few and hurt most

Another factor may be that more people work in more productive jobs. Empolyers don't just cut back on operations because the employees that they have work less hours. Maybe they hire more. Efficiency is pretty close to productivity.

[Ted Striker]

Originally posted by Spiffor
I would just like to point out that studies have shown, since the intorduction of the 35 hours workweek, that workers have become more efficient per hour, and the average hour of work by a Frenchman is much more than the same hour worked by an American. That's because, thanks to our reasonable schedules, we spend our time at the working doing some actual work. There is far less time spent at the workplace for entertainment (like posting on 'Poly). Such is what we do in our free time.

The 35 hours workweek had no negative impact on our growth, and had a slight but positive impact on our unemployment. The real problem of the French society and economy is unemployment, but repelling the 35 hours workweek won't help it any. It will only worsen our quality of life with extremely little in return. According to polls, about only 20% of the population wishes to work more, which means that repelling the 35 hours workweek will benefit a few and hurt most

[mindseye]

Originally posted by Spiffor

There is far less time spent at the workplace for entertainment (like posting on 'Poly). Such is what we do in our free time.

So Americans get paid to post on 'Poly, but the French have to do it in their free time?

You sure you're getting the good end of that deal?

[el freako]

Originally posted by mindseye


So Americans get paid to post on 'Poly, but the French have to do it in their free time?

You sure you're getting the good end of that deal?

Of course, the American's are restricted in the leisure activities they can do whilst 'working' whilst the French, with their shorter hours have more freedom to choose and therefore more liberty than the americans.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Spiffor
The 35 hours workweek had no negative impact on our growth, and had a slight but positive impact on our unemployment.

I call BS. The whole idea the Socialist government used to sell the idea (That it would lead to higher employment) is based on a fallacy.

[Ted Striker]

I call BS on your BS.


What measure of improved unemployment would satisfy you anyway? It did move in the right direction.


Besides, it's their country, they like the law, what the hell do you care anyway.