HRE NES

[appleciders]

Duke Arnulf of Bavaria to Doge Orso II Participazio
I understand completely. My request for help was directed more at Geffery of Evreux's forces. I thank you for your partnership in this matter, and hope to recommence our salt trade soon. Also, one final detail regarding your mercenaries- Geffery of Evreux has offered to swear allegiance to me. Is he still under contract to you?

Duke Arnulf of Bavaria to Geffery of Evreux
I would not have you disobey your orders given you by the Doge of Venice. I must retain good relations with him to achieve favorable trade deals. If, however, you can work out an arrangement with him releasing you from your contract, I would consider awarding moderate estates to you and at least some of your Normans. However, I have had so much trouble lately with rebellious vassals, I would question my subjects' willingness to be governed by foreigners. I am willing to make you a Count with a sizeable estate, and but I have already promised the Margravate of Carinthia to my younger brother Eberhard. Should the King refuse to confirm Eberhard as Margravate of Carinthia, I might reconsider you as a potential governer. Your valor in battle, in any case, deserves my profound thanks, and I will see that you are rewarded once my treasury is recovered.

[Micha]

Duke Heinrich of Saxony to Duke Arnulf of Bavaria
Be not worried, these men will indeed be available for the next year to continue the siege. I feel disgusted at Weinzberg´s treachery; The mere idea of such cowardice and spinelessness amongst the nobility of the lands of our fathers makes me sick! Fortunately there is still bravery and loyality, and I will see personally for a proper reward to von Dortmund.
I apologize for the meager size of the reinforcements, but that was all that could be assembled in such short time. With the March of Meissen somewhat secured, you can expect a bit more involvement of Saxon troops in royal campaigns.

Duke Heinrich of Saxony to King Conrad of Germany
My liege, I am happy to report to you the annihilation of any organized resistance in the March of Meissen. With your blessing, the land has been annexed as a separate territory to the Saxon Duchy; As per our contract, you will receive one tenth of any income generated there.
Since the Wends are predominantly haethen people, I plan on leading them to the one true religion. Of course I cannot do so alone. May I ask you to speak to the pope on this matter? I heard you were planning a visit anyway. I´m sure he will be willing to spread the word of god into the lush forests and fertile meadows of the March of Meissen...
Thank you, my lord!

Duke Heinrich of Saxony to Freiherr Heidolf von Dortmund
The recent events have brought some unexpected twists and revealed the true nature of some subjects... As such, I am most pleased with the handling of affairs by the honorable Saxon lords. Now I expect you to teach the traitors in Regensburg a lesson which nobody will ever forget!
Afterwards, I will await your report at the great feast in Bremen, where you may sit at the Ducal table - we have things to discuss...

[appleciders]

Duke Arnulf of Bavaria to Emperor Berengar I of Friuli
My Emperor, I must inquire as to your motives in moving your army into Bavaria. Is there something you require?

[Cyclotron]

Doge Orso II Participazio to Duke Arnulf of Bavaria
Our contract with d'Evreux was one drawn up for the specific purpose of assisting you in Carinthia. He is most welcome to pledge allegiance to you or any other party; in fact, taking him and his men off our hands would save us money, since we'd not have to pay them for the duration of their journey back to Venice.

Geffrey of Evreux to Duke Arnulf of Bavaria
I understand your position, however, I cannot think only of myself; I have 120 comrades of mine who would also require knightly estates. I am told many of your vassals in Carinthia have most unfortunately perished or rebelled against you; perhaps my men can take control of the estates left by them? For my part, I would gladly settle for a position as the Count of Vienna and its environs.

Though I am capable of aiding your efforts immediately, I must release the Venetians in my company soon, as well as the Italian mercenaries, who are growing restless. I will be able to aid you with my men and the Franks under my command, who have agreed to join me in aiding you for the rest of the sum Venice has provided me with for such discretionary measures.

Freiherr Heidolf von Dortmund to Duke Heinrich of Saxony
My Lord, I am ever at your service.

Emperor Berengar I to Duke Arnulf of Bavaria
Berengar I, Emperor of all Christendom and Regent of Christ on Earth, has great concern for the upheaval in your lands and the threat posed to his estates by unfolding events. He has not yet entered your lands, out of respect for your authority, though should it please the Emperor your borders will concern neither him nor his men; he acts always in accordance with the will of God.

The Emperor notes with displeasure that you have left Carinthia completely to savages and rebels, open to the ravages of Magyars and traitors, endangering your neighbors and demonstrating your disregard for your duties of stewardship. The Emperor further notes that Carinthia has fallen into the hands of mercenary bands, who have been allowed to wantonly kill a man wanted by an Imperial court.

Thus, the Emperor finds it neccessary to place the March of Carinthia under his temporary authority as an Imperial Protectorate, until such time as he deems you prepared to adequately administer it. You are requested and required to withdraw all forces from Carinthia not personally approved by the Emperor. A magistrate will be appointed to oversee the defense and administration of the territory when the Emperor must inevitably be called away by other business.

Emperor Berengar I to King Conrad of Germany
Berengar I, Emperor of all Christendom and Regent of Christ on Earth, bids you his greetings in this time of trial and uncertainty. He furthermore requests and requires that you proceed immediately to Vienna, to rendezvous with the Imperial Army and speak personally with his Imperial majesty.

[appleciders]

Cyc, do I have the authority to appoint nobility in Carinthia after I have transferred the Margravate to another person?

Duke Arnulf of Bavaria to King Conrad of Germany
My liege, I must protest Berengar's proposed "protectorate" of Carinthia. This smacks to me of an outright annexation of land rightfully conquered and held by myself and my father. Please consider my interests when (and if) you meet Berengar.

Duke Arnulf of Bavaria to Geffery of Evreux
I would certainly be willing to confirm you as Count of Vienna! Your men will be given other estates from the traitorous nobility, both in Carinthia and in Bavaria. For the moment, I'll ask you to compile a list of exactly who your army is comprised of.

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by appleciders
Cyc, do I have the authority to appoint nobility in Carinthia after I have transferred the Margravate to another person?

No, but you don't lose this authority until the Markgraf is confirmed and recieves oaths of loyalty from all the nobility of the March.

At this point in time, Counts are sworn to the Duke, not the King. A Count in Bavaria has no technical fealty owed to the King, but rather to his Duke. A Count under a Markgraf has a wierd kind of simultaneous fealty to both Duke and Markgraf. On the one hand, the feudal system dictates he has fealty to his direct superior and fief-giver, the Markgraf; on the other, Germany is still very tribe-oriented - the Duke of Saxony doesn't just rule Saxony, he is the ruler of the Saxons, and thus theoretically all Saxons are bound to him, even ones in Saxon Marches. These tribal affiliations far predate the construction of the German Kingdom.

The ability to enfeoff is integral to a high feudal office, and it would be considered a great affront to make somebody a Count without giving them the ability to enfeoff Barons, and the same thing goes for Markgrafs.

Geffery of Evreux to Duke Arnulf
This can be easily done. All my men are Normans from Normandy; most were in the army of Duke Hrolf (whom you call Rollo Ganger), who besieged Paris several years ago. We know little of your feudal system, and as such none of us are technically "knights," though in our homeland we are warriors and have status from this. Many were hirdmen, bonded companions to the Duke, who have since been released to seek their fortunes abroad.

I can personally vouch that not one of my men is wanted for crimes in Normandy or in any other way infamous in our country.

My men and I are Christian; Duke Hrolf took the baptism and thus we are Christian as well. Some in my band still worship the old gods of our ancestors as well, but they will all respect the religious wishes of their lord.

I shall furnish you with a list of names when I reach Regensburg.

[Cyclotron]

Extra!

The Duchy-specific bits have been added to the update. There is an additional bit of news in the update, under the "Other news of Christendom" section - Saxony especially should check it out!

The map is updated but not uploaded yet. When it is:

- Meissen is bigger
- So is Bohemia
- Kingdom of the Danes added

[appleciders]

Duke Arnulf of Bavaria to Geffery of Evreux
I will expect of you and your men strict adherance to Christianity, as I've had enough trouble with the Church, and currently my relations with the Church are among the strongest of my tools. I do also expect that you and your men will integrate into our feudal system as it stands. Your Normans will be made Counts and Knights, and will as such be expected to serve in my army when called up, as the rest of my knights do. I also must express apprehension in appointing foreigners to these high posts- your men must not remove existing German Barons if these Barons were faithful to me, and may not bring other Normans into Germany to serve as Barons. To be blunt, I must have your men fully integrate into German society- factionalism will weaken Bavaria tremendously.

That said, I hope that this will help replenish the ranks of my chivalry, and I must say I am pleased to be able to add your personal talents to my army's arsenal. I must have a list both of the men who plan to stay in Bavaria and Carinthia and the enlisted soldiers in your army- I need to plan my defense of Carinthia from raids and my siege of Regensburg.

[foolish_icarus]

friendly 'paternal' advice for Arnulf:
Quit fracking asking the Emperor if there's something he requires!

Opening Questions:

von Mellrichstadt is with me and my army right?

What are the usual obligations associated with receiving orders for an audience with an Emperor in a city that he doesn't even control, and is, in fact, openly hostile to him, when one is a King known to be on campaign to crush a rebellion and after that very much needs to go back to fighting a cruel pagan horde?
Berengar, ******* numero uno ( )
EDIT, ah, in Berengar's message I read "meet at Vienna" as "meet at Venice" and was thinking, wow, that's going to be interesting
Nonetheless, most of my point/question still stands.

As for his Carinthian ambitions, let me guess...the precedent is; whoever has the bigger army gets to do what he wants?


Now this question is entirely to satisfy my personal curiosity, but when the commander of the Swabian relief forces told his King something to the effect of, --
naw, we're not really that keen on helping out against either rebels or Magyars, and we are in fact, going home, but thanks for the 'suggestion' my liege!
What were the exact ****ing words he used, and what happened to stay my hand from bashing his face in? Cause I must have been feeling really goddamn pious that day...mumble...*twitch*


Okay now some diplo...

to my sons Arnulf and Eberhard :

I will indeed happily confirm Eberhard's appointment to Carinthia! But that will have to wait until we get this rebellion rounded up and I figure out what that...man...the--the Emperor is thinking. May God grant me patience.


to the Duke of Bohemians :

[pass on the intelligence received from the Bulgarians]


to Count Odo of Neuchatel :

Actually I desire you to remain in Bohemia and work with their forces to counter possible Magyar threats. I have no doubt you will exercise sound judgement and valour in this endeavor, and your courage and honour is greatly appreciated. Godspeed.


to Heidolf von Dortmund :

You've done an excellent job, good sir knight! I wish to confer with you about the Franconian troops you captured. We must determine whether it will be best to add them to my contingent, leave them under your command, or find some other use for them.


to Arnulf

Of course we're all here to stay until this nasty business is put to an end. You've held on admirably well so far. I will pray you get over your illness soon; we must also take steps to make sure it doesn't spread [OOC: Cyclotron, I'm not sure exactly how much these people knew at this time about diseases, I knew they had a mixed understanding of contagion and superstition, so in any case I believe checking the quality of food and water and enacting some sort of quarantine and perhaps even some sort of measures of sanitation would be in character]
You've currently got that little weasel of a traitor of mine under lock and key somewhere, if time permits we'll get some sort of quick little trial going, until then he can stay with your men. I've no desire to set eyes upon him until necessary.


to King Rudolph II of Burgundy

Please, there is no need to apologize for such a thing. It seems God smiles upon us for I believe it is indeed fortunate you men remain for now in Bohemia where I am certain they will conduct themselves admirably against the heathens. I offer you my thanks and well wishes.


send Fejedelem Szabolcs' messenger back to him (unharmed, of course) with the following message

Ride east and never stop. If I ever find your host I will obliterate it.


to Simeon I, Emperor of the Bulgarians and Romans

Thank you for your intelligence. I pray for your success.


to Duke Heinrich of Saxony

Greetings! Your success on the field of battle and at home are admirable! May the Mark Meissen prosper under your guidance. I currently do not forsee a papal visit any time in the near future, but if I ever do have the fortune to visit his Holiness I will certainly speak to him about Meissen.

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by foolish_icarus
von Mellrichstadt is with me and my army right?

That is correct.

What are the usual obligations associated with receiving orders for an audience with an Emperor in a city that he doesn't even control, and is, in fact, openly hostile to him, when one is a King known to be on campaign to crush a rebellion and after that very much needs to go back to fighting a cruel pagan horde?

I believe the assumption is that he will control the city by the time you arrive. As far as I am aware, it is not "openly hostile" to him; most of the citizens of Vienna probably do not really care who controls their city as long as they suffer no ill effects from it.

There is no written code that says what the Emperor can and cannot do; nowhere does it say "thou shalt meet the Emperor when he demands." Legally, you don't have to go, but to not go would obviously strain your relations with the Emperor. If you ever came in conflict later, the Emperor - for example - might use your refusal to attend as proof of your hostility towards his Imperial majesty, and by extension, Christendom. Certainly it would make any kind of Imperial aid for any reason much less likely.

As for his Carinthian ambitions, let me guess...the precedent is; whoever has the bigger army gets to do what he wants?

Unless you'd like to challenge him, that is.

Now this question is entirely to satisfy my personal curiosity, but when the commander of the Swabian relief forces told his King something to the effect of, --
naw, we're not really that keen on helping out against either rebels or Magyars, and we are in fact, going home, but thanks for the 'suggestion' my liege!
What were the exact ****ing words he used, and what happened to stay my hand from bashing his face in? Cause I must have been feeling really goddamn pious that day...mumble...*twitch*

You have no authority to tell the Swabian troops or commanders where they can and cannot go. The commander informed you that his orders were to aid you in fighting the Magyars, and since you are no longer engaged thusly, he is going home.

The deeper reason is likely one of uncertainty. Rebellion is sweeping through Germany and nobody has heard from the Duke of Swabia in some time. The commander is probably worried about his lands and standing back in Swabia; nobles are loathe to be abroad when there is insurrection or uncertainty back home.

As for his "exact words," there were none face to face. He sent you a note saying he was leaving, citing his orders to help you with Magyars, and citing the rebellion as reason to return to Swabia and defend the interests of his Duke. Then he and his men marched promptly away.

Count Odo of Neuchatel to King Conrad
I have sent word of your wishes to my leige and this is satisfactory. I will remain with Duke Vratislaus until you have further need of me, or I am recalled by my Lord.


Heidolf von Dortmund to King Conrad:
Your Highness, you have my thanks. As I merely lead the forces of my Lord, Duke Heinrich, you must confer with him as to the Franconian troops under my command. Should my Lord request their release to your command, they will be immediately so released.

OOC: Cyclotron, I'm not sure exactly how much these people knew at this time about diseases, I knew they had a mixed understanding of contagion and superstition, so in any case I believe checking the quality of food and water and enacting some sort of quarantine and perhaps even some sort of measures of sanitation would be in character

Your officials report that the river upstream from Regensburg appears to be befouled with offal and noxious waste. Soldiers were found upstream dumping said waste into the river; when questioned, they replied that they are acting on the standing orders of Duke Arnulf of Bavaria, and refused to desist until such orders are rescinded. Your officials note that much of the army is currently drawing water from downstream of this pollution.

If you desire to enact a quarantine, you'll have to be more specific - are you quarantining the entire Bavarian army?

[foolish_icarus]

I believe the assumption is that he will control the city by the time you arrive. As far as I am aware, it is not "openly hostile" to him; most of the citizens of Vienna probably do not really care who controls their city as long as they suffer no ill effects from it.

See my edit. Meeting in Vienna is in a few ways a far more reasonable command than meeting in Venice

If bp doesn't come back before the next update,will you answer diplo/make decisions as the Duke until bp returns?

At the moment I am enacting no sort of quarantine on any one, except to direct my officers of the state of the river. Perhaps they can find water elsewhere. Do we know about the benefits of boiling water?

Also, General listings coming up, yes?

to Heidolf von Dortmund

Quite so. I desire to learn from you what you know of their conduct and disposition since their capture before I converse with the Duke.


to Arnulf

I think it's time to stop dumping offal in the water unless we can come up with a way to provision and water our own men and animals with untainted supplies.
I am going to go meet Emperor Berengar in Vienna after this is all done with. We shant hurry here, we shall take as much time as we need. Berengar can wait for me if necessary.
Your man seems to have a very good handle on this siege business, but you should not be taxed by the details of such business while you are recovering from your illness. Just tell me your basic plans and objectives and I and the rest of the generals will carry out the details from there.


send a reply to Emperor Berengar that says with all the necessary courtesies that I will meet him in Vienna as he requests. 'Course, said message should not make any promise as to when I'll be there, other than 'soon, hopefully'.

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by foolish_icarus See my edit. Meeting in Vienna is in a few ways a far more reasonable command than meeting in Venice

Yep. Sorry!

If bp doesn't come back before the next update,will you answer diplo/make decisions as the Duke until bp returns?

I suppose so. Either that, or wait one more turn.

At the moment I am enacting no sort of quarantine on any one, except to direct my officers of the state of the river. Perhaps they can find water elsewhere. Do we know about the benefits of boiling water?

There are no water sources nearby capable of watering an army. There is no way to bring a suitable volume of water from upriver, and moving the army to an upriver position would essentially lift the siege.

I do not believe there is a knowledge of the health effects of boiling water, though if a source can be cited, I will reconsider.

Also, General listings coming up, yes?

Quite, along with stat block, map, mercenary board, and so on. More time!

Freiherr Heidolf von Dortmund to King Conrad
Your Highness, they have behaved like all such levy soldiers I have had under my command; obedient but unenthusiastic. I do not believe any of them were co-conspirators with their leader. While they seem to have known that their leader was marching against Duke Arnulf, they appeared genuinely surprised when I informed them that they were being led against their rightful King and Duke. Save for the differences in speech and manners from the Saxons I have previously led, I find them no different in conduct or disposition than other levies.

[foolish_icarus]

to Heidolf von Dortmund

Very good. Thank you.


to Duke Heinrich

Greetings again. Your man Heidolf von Dortmund had done an impressive job, and from what little I have seen and the much I have heard, he is a courageous, skilful, and agreeable soldier, who, I am pleased to say, has taken good care of the levy men formerly under von Weinzburg. I now request that you send him instruction to release those men and their equipment and arms back to my command.

[appleciders]

Originally posted by foolish_icarus
to Arnulf
I think it's time to stop dumping offal in the water unless we can come up with a way to provision and water our own men and animals with untainted supplies.
I am going to go meet Emperor Berengar in Vienna after this is all done with. We shant hurry here, we shall take as much time as we need. Berengar can wait for me if necessary.
Your man seems to have a very good handle on this siege business, but you should not be taxed by the details of such business while you are recovering from your illness. Just tell me your basic plans and objectives and I and the rest of the generals will carry out the details from there.

Yeah, I had sort of come to the same conclusion. I was trying to foul the waters within Regensburg, but it seems to have backfired a bit. I didn't plan to go to Vienna for another reason, actually- I don't fully trust my siege expert. He's a former mercenary himself, and I'd prefer to actually succeed at this, rather than face my third rebellion in as many years.

My objectives considering Carinthia are quite simple at the moment- keep control of the Mark myself (probably through my brother). I don't want to lose control to either the Magyars or the Emperor. If the Magyars and the Imperial Army destroy each other, I would be quite satisfied.

Ooooh, and check it out: Water purification techniques dating back to 2000 B.C. Now, whether the Germans knew this is 917 A.D. is Cyc's call. http://www.lenntech.com/water-disinf...sinfection.htm

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by appleciders
Ooooh, and check it out: Water purification techniques dating back to 2000 B.C. Now, whether the Germans knew this is 917 A.D. is Cyc's call. http://www.lenntech.com/water-disinf...sinfection.htm

The key is not that boiling wasn't practiced - it probably was - but that purifying water in ancient times had little to do with disease. Water was purified to improve taste, or perhaps as only one part of a wellness strategy (e.g. "drink pure water because bad water contributes to unbalanced bodily humors / lets bad miasmas in / other crazy mumbo-jumbo"). Dirty or impure water was not linked directly with sickness.

The Germans may well know that boiling water makes it "cleaner" in a visible and tasteable sense; they do not know that it has any kind of effect on disease, and their response to an epidemic would not be to start boiling water.

Arnulf's original plan makes sense; everyone knows that foul stuff can cause plagues (that's why they hurled cow carcasses in catapults and such). Stopping the dumping also makes sense; if there's dead cow nearby, you might get sick. Water without obvious (visible) impurities, however, is assumed to be pure and wholsesome, and thus boiling would not be a sensible approach from a medieval perspective.