Welcome To Bitterfrost!

[tanelorn]

Perhaps the syntax is wrong, in this particular event. It crashes for me too. But IF unitkilled=ANYUNIT goes for ToT 100% this is positive.
Then again, if you use the Editor to make an events file, and make manual modifications, the game may crash for no aparent reason. I suppose this goes vice-versa.

The moral being, "do not use the editor for events, ever"

[curtsibling]

@Pericles:

I'll send you the new zip, and see if you can help me unravel this mystery!

[St Leo]

Originally posted by curtsibling
But the Coven and Crusaders have a ton of settlers, but refuse to use them...Despite an abundance of plains and grasslands near them...What gives????

Someone help!
EEK!

Dunno. The fact that the AI refused to use settlers ruined much of my Imperial Ambition.

[Palaiologos]

Originally posted by tanelorn
Then again, if you use the Editor to make an events file, and make manual modifications, the game may crash for no aparent reason. I suppose this goes vice-versa.

The moral being, "do not use the editor for events, ever"

The events editor has never crashed for me when i am doing manual changes.

But i can tell you people this:Just the other day the bloody @#$!@ editor erased the whole Cosmic principles and tech tree sections of my rules.txt!!!

Couldn't believe my eyes.I am never going to use those editors again.

[curtsibling]

My two thoughts for today:

1. The CIV2 editor is crap.

2. The CIV2 AI should be shot at dawn.

[Cyrion]

[curtsibling]

I should say that Pericles and I are performing a range of alchemical expriments on the files to try and get this AI settler conundrum sorted!

New data will be listed as it arrives!

[tanelorn]

Just to let you know, I gave workers maximum movement allowance and started skaning the map with the tutorial mode on. Although food yield is set higher than in vanila CIV, the "this is a nice spot to build a city" appeared only 3-4 times, over almost the entire map. So the AI doesn't think there are enough suitable places to build cities on this map.

Did you try setting terrain values to the original CIV ones (at least food-wise)?

Most terrains now have a uniform food yield of 2, which makes it hard for the AI to decide that a specific place has a clear advantage for it to build a city on (I guess)

[Palaiologos]

Good thinking Timoleon!
It actually confirms the assumptions of the latest "alchemical" experiment.

Anyway i've already found out the problem(i think.....) and e-mailed Curt about it.

ARIANAAAARA OMADAAAARA,OE OE OE OOOOO!!!!!

[tanelorn]

I did some checking too,meanwhile to prove it. I set the game on auto till warmpeak 21. Results:
Cities-
Coven 3 (built 1)
Zatarn 2 (built 1 on the only clearing they found)
Undead 4 (built none)
Bursar 2 (built none)
Crusade 3 (Built 1)
Harpy 1

Then I changed @terain with @terain from the original game, and found the culprit!!!!

Cities-
Coven 35
Zatarn 2 (on the same clearing as before)
Undead 64! 64!
Bursar 10
Crusade 21
Harpy1 but they had built 1more on the shore and it was taken by the Bursar (it had a harpy name, and a revealed map up to it.)

Conclusion: Workers avoid dense forests, like those on the western (Zatarn) and southern (Bursar) coast at all costs. They also generaly avoid continuous icelands, but not on the same degree.

The Harpies won't start building before they get sight of land.

Suggested fix:
1- Change the terrain values closer to the original game ones.
2- Cut more clearings in the forests so as not to deter workers from building cities
3- Vary iceland terrain a bit on the southeasten shore (Crusade)
4- Give the harpies a visible patch of the coast from the begining, so the AI'll know where to move to.
It took me more time to write this than to check it.
I even double-checked, this is it.

[tanelorn]

Minor observartions:

On both file-sets, a number of AI workers stick on walls, buzzing on and off them. Mining hills seems to be hardwired in the system, so they try to mine even if they are not allowed by the rules.

Despite their having an increased variety of options, all build just the basic defense and attack unit.
Only the coven build all 3 initial types.
The Undead prefer building spectres to vile skeletons.
Perhaps because so much of the map is so large and dark, they are geared towards exploration (they prefer movement to attack/defense value)

[Palaiologos]

Thats weird Tim.

You see in all my tests it was the Zatarn who built a ton of cities, with the three human kingdoms building none.

IIRC so it was in the first version as well.

Oh i forgot...
Curt is using a new map now(with continents on it)


One of the tests i did was this:I gave everybody the worker unit and made the other types(Nest mothers, undead workers etc.) not available,just to be sure.Result was that everybody started building cities.
At a point i used the civ2 original rules file and they even built cities on tundras(they kept loosing them by famine though....).

And amazingly in my games the Coven only built the basic defense and scouting unit!It was a walk in the park to conquer them!

Which difficulty were your tests made in?

[tanelorn]

On the recomended Champion level. This is because bellow Prince (Champion) level the game handicaps the AI players, and above it the AI cheats.
At Prince it's even.

The results where from the games with the standard @Terrain, with the numerous cities. Perhaps it is related to the size of the empire, perhaps it is due to the fact that the Coven were attacking the Undead, that had them surrounded.

I am positive that the AI won't build cities on forest terrain. The Zatarn are the forest chicks. Where did they build their cities?

[tanelorn]

Ãéá íá ãïõóôáñåé áëçèéíá ìéá ãõíáéêá êáìðéíãê ðñåðåé íá'íáé áíôéêïéíùíéêç,*ã*ìçôç, ìðé÷ëïöéëç,êåñáôïõêëù, áðåëðéóìåíç, öôõóìåíç & ãåíéêùò âëáììåíç.

A comment about the Zatarn love for the forests. No wonder they are grey and have horns, hey Peri?

Think about this too, by Cyrion in another thread:

"Unfortunately, not all unit slots can be barbarians. Oh, sure, it will create the unit - but it will vanish within a single turn. So, what units vanish and what ones stay around?

The units that stay around the longest are the modern units. Of those I tried, the longest lasting were: ironclads, cruisers, AEGIS cruisers, battleships, partisans, riflemen, paratroopers, armors, howitzers and cavalry. Other artillery-type units also lasted a long time. Earlier units tend to vanish more quickly (e.g., phalanx). If you produce a unit in one of the early ship slots, like caravels, they vanish within the turn -- not even lasting long enough to capture a city."

[Palaiologos]

Here are the saves, see for yourself.

The bur1 is one of Curt's saves.You'll notice that the Crusaders and Coven have built no cities at all, while the Zatarn are expanding normally.

Prince difficulty,Bursars.


The Ig.auto is one of my saves AFTER i gave everybody access to the normal settler unit and dissalowed the rest.

Notice that everybody is building cities normally(the undeads have actually built one city and conquered the Harpies.

Crusaders, Deity.

It is on Curt's new map BTW.