The 'Stuff Iraq Has That They Don't Have' thread.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by faded glory


This is a blantant lie. I dont know who started this, the left throws this around like it means something. In the 1980's we gave Iraq about 60 million dollars (chump change compared to the 90 billion the USSR gave Iraq!) in aid but never was there any weapons transfers between US and Iraqi governments....ever

The USSR never "gave" 90 billion to anyone, anywhere, for anything. You must have pulled that number out of the orifice of your choice.

As for US aid programs, as well as military support via intelligence analysts, satellite and aerial intel, etc., that's all a matter of public record in the Federal District Court in Atlanta, Georgia, where principals of the Banco Nazionale di Lavorno were tried for their alleged "illegal" transfers to Iraq. It was a bit embarassing to the prosecutors when it was demonstrated by the defense with US government documents that the US taxpayer guaranteed over six billion in improperly documented (by US) and improperly authorized (again by US) Dept. of Agriculture and Dept. of Commerce loan guarantees. This was part of a combined 40 billion in aid from the US and Arab countries to keep Iraq in it's war with Iran.

BTW, the DIA long ago concluded the vast majority of fatalities from Halabja were consistent with cyanide poisoning, and the Iraqis never had or developed cyanide based agents. They used mustard and VX at Halabja, the Iranians used cyanide base agents. You figure it out. The same way you figure out how incensed the US was at the time. The silence was near deafening.

Now compare that to the military equipment bought from France, USSR, and Germany.....


hmmm..

Who gave the Iraqi's Mirage F-1's, MiG-29's and T-72's?
Who gave them Chem and Bio weapons?

Nobody "gave" them anything. The Iraqis bought it on the open market, and the US isn't really in much position to *****, seeing as we're the largest arms exporter in the world.

I win!

Yes, you win the "perpetually clueless" award once again, gas pumper.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by GePap

Where oh where have the WMD gone? Where oh where could they be?

Simon Bar Sinister is going to use them on Sweet Polly Purebred.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Originally posted by Kaak
confirmed by reuters....

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=578&ncid=578&e=5&u=/nm/20030404/ts_nm/iraq_vials_dc

now, let's all say it together...BUSH 2004!!!

It helps if you read past the first paragraph.

"In February 2003, inspectors from the U.N. Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission went to Latifiya to see if any prohibited materials were there. They did not find anything but stated in a report that they deemed Iraq's "description and rationale inadequate."


Separately, Brigadier General Vincent Brooks told a news briefing at U.S. Central Command in Qatar that special forces in Iraq's western desert had found what they believed to be a training school for handling chemical warfare.


"We know that the Iraqis have conducted chemical training," he said, adding that initial evidence suggested that this was not a site housing weapons of mass destruction."

Close, but no cigar. And given the ****ing Bush is giving the economy, Bush in 2004 is far from a sure bet.

[realpolitic]

Originally posted by Frogger
So the new york times is lying?

The Iraqi ambassador to the U.N. Claimed that everyone was lying but the Iraqis.lol:

[Lancer]

They did find two intact long range missiles, don't recall the type.

Only 17 days in...

[Lancer]

Looks like they found something chemical...not sure yet though.

[Sava]

I've heard rumor in the past week about supposed chemical caches and some mass gravesite. Both turned out to be false. But the American media hypes the original report and then barely mentions the retraction, if at all. I'm not really concerned about illegal missiles. Big deal, so they can fly 120 miles instead of 93. Getting those missiles certainly isn't worth the amount of money this war is costing.

If the troops find actual chemical or biological caches, then maybe I'll listen to a damn word the Bush admin says. So far, all I've seen is a single bookcase of what is allegedly, possibly a substance that could be eventually used to create a chemical program... that is later proved to be nothing.

If Saddam has so many damn WMD the troops should be able to find them.

[spiritof1202]

http://www.msnbc.com/news/895392_asp.htm?0cv=CA01

NEAR KARBALA, Iraq, April 7 — U.S. Army commanders say they have discovered more than a dozen barrels of chemicals in an agricultural facility 30 miles northeast of here that have tested positive as blister and nerve agents. If that initial analysis is backed up by further testing, it would be the first confirmed seizure by U.S. forces of Iraqi chemical weapons.

[Willem]

From the same article:

But sarin is also used in low levels in pesticides, which were found at the camp, so it is not clear if the facility is a nerve agent site or merely an agricultural facility.

[spiritof1202]

what about the tabin, and the blister agent?

[Dr Strangelove]

On Reuters, just reported a few minutes ago, allied troops claim to have found a number of missles with sarin and mustard gas warheads.

[Willem]

Originally posted by spiritof1202
what about the tabin, and the blister agent?

What about that supposed chemical plant that turned out to be a false alarm? Until there's more conclusive information, there's no point in jumping the gun. I don't know anything about tabun or lewisite, but it might turn out that they're just ordinary ingredients for pesticides as well, or have some other legitimate purpose.

If they really did find something, you can be sure that the whole world will know about it soon enough; the Pentagon will be running a media circus with the information. Until then it's a good idea to remain sceptical. There's been far to many false reports coming out since the war started; it's not a good idea to believe everything you read at the moment.

[GePap]

Well, another thing they "aren't supposed to have" are ties with Al qaeda. The Us took over Ansar Al-Islam's (oh, yeah, remember them) headquarters about a week ago and found a lot of documents: lets see how long until they say some of them show ties between baghdad and Al qaeda. Remember, we have Ansar's documents already, so fi you hear nothing, well, we know about that claim.

Also, were are Saddam's hidden SCUDS? Ddin;t he have 20 or so? Haven't heard anything about them since the false reports week one.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Given the Iraqi's evasion and game playing with UNMOVIC and UNSCOM before that, there really should be no surprise to anyone but the most clueless that Saddam has prohibited stuff, and fairly decent amounts of it.

If there's anything debateable, it's whether what he has is substantial enough to be close enough to a threat to justify the cost of the US invasion.

[GePap]

Until the invasion I never questioned whether he had stuff. Now I may question the amounts, since given what we now hold, you would think someone would have found even just a single shell filled with something banned- but as of now, zippo.

As i said elsewhere, I really want this admin. to be able to catalogue each of the claims they made and what came of them, with stuff like the mobile biological labs and so forth.