Has the right to dissent in this country vanished since 9/11?

[Sava]

Originally posted by monkspider
Poor Chris.
In all honesty, I think we would take your arguements more seriously here if you didn't always try to flame, insult, antagonize, etc. everyone who has a different viewpoint than you.

Without that, Chris wouldnt' be able to post at all.

[Pekka]

Well, the way I see it, she has the right to do that. But, it's her own choice, and if she willingfully disses the flag in front of lots of soldiers, she must take the kaka for doing it. If that happened to me, I'd take that as personal insult, for her to come my place, and then diss the flag and what it stands for and therefore disses every soldier in there.. I think she could have chosen a better place to practise her rights. Some would say it was the best place, I say it was the worst place, because it offended people and their work. She could have made special deal this time and just shut her eyes and not listen the song and think of dying children or something. Bad taste.

I wouldn't go to gays'r'us to promote hetero life and say you're all wrong and sick. Even if it was my right. If I believed in my message, I would instead try to get my word out in a different place, and not to attack 'the wrong doers' directly. That would be bad taste too. Nah, I think I lost my point.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Pekka
I wouldn't go to gays'r'us to promote hetero life and say you're all wrong and sick. Even if it was my right. If I believed in my message, I would instead try to get my word out in a different place, and not to attack 'the wrong doers' directly. That would be bad taste too. Nah, I think I lost my point.

Terrible analogy. If you went to a gay rights rally, and if before the rally started they made everyone stand up and proclaim themselves gay and proud and give a big ol' kiss to the queer next to them, would you want to join in? And if you chose not to by just standing in silence, and everyone started jeering you and telling you that you were a traitor and you should just leave the country, would you consider that a just response to your silent refusal?

I sure wouldn't.

[Pekka]

Besides, if I was unhappy about the direction my country was about to take, or not to take, I still would not disrespect the flag. I would disrespect the leaders, the people who made the decisions and took courses I didn't like. It would be their fault, not the flags, or the ideals the country stands for. Different people have different America. This girl is worried about some things America is not doing for their citizens, and are doing outside the US. So, she believes in America that is about justice and fairness and all that, with her own idea of those concepts. Why would she still disrespect the flag, and not the Bush administration? I think it's always cool to not like some leader, but it's a different thing to pull stunts like that. And if she doesn't see the difference, then why won't she leave the country then? That's what I'm planning of doing in the near future (I hope) too.. and still I'm not dissing the flag.

But sure, I still wouldn't attack this girl and shout her, I'd just leave her alone with her bad taste.

[Pekka]

Boris, I admit. It doesn't work like I said.. You're right, I was wrong.

[Imran Siddiqui]

The KKK is a better analogy... always .

--

Oh, and I hope Boris and Chris stop going 'bezerker' on us .

[Pekka]

ok ok ok ok.. all I meant to say was that she has a right to do that I guess, and people have right to response to her act. I'm not trying to defend anyone, it's stupid to shout at her anyway.. But I'd like to point out, that she knew where she was and still did it, so she accepted getting bashed then. You have to pick up the right battles to win the war!

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Oh, and I hope Boris and Chris stop going 'bezerker' on us .

I will parse him 'round the Cape, 'round the Horn, and through Perdition's Flames!

[Spiffor]

I come from a country where it is now illegal to boo the national anthem. Consider yourself lucky only to be attacked by thugs when you disrespect national symbols, rather than the police

More seriously, the people who told her to go home were jerks, but I don't see how it endangers free speech in the US. As long as there are no laws to forbid dissent, it is up to dissenters to organize against the rising bigotry : they have the right to.

A good ideological shift is what America needs, not an anti-insult law.

[SpencerH]

Originally posted by GePap
she cou;ld have done somehting confrontational, like worn some shirt with some logo, and not just this gesture.

Even if she didnt predict the intensity of the response, what she's doing is pretty confrontational for this time and place.

All Smith and Carlos did was wear one glove and raise it during the national anthem. It was a simple act, but it stirred a lot of blood on both sides.

[SpencerH]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
The KKK is a better analogy... always .

I hear they have some pretty good BBQ picnics.









Foodwise anyways.

[Imran Siddiqui]

[Zero]

I have been not standing up for the national anthem nor reciting them for quite a long time and nobody really says anything to me. Why don't I get any publicity?

Oh yeah because in my case, I'm just too lazy to get up, not because I have some cool statement to make.

The situation sounds alot like the book, the Chocolate War.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by SpencerH
All Smith and Carlos did was wear one glove and raise it during the national anthem. It was a simple act, but it stirred a lot of blood on both sides.

Erm, can anyone explain the stroy to an ignorant Cheese-eating-surrender-monkey please ?

[Zero]

Originally posted by Pekka
Boris, I admit. It doesn't work like I said.. You're right, I was wrong.

My respect for Pekka just increased ten folds. You dont see people in forums admiting that they are wrong often.