Was Stalin really that evil?

[Az]

We're getting sidetracked here, though I would say that the damage that Stalin has caused the socialist movement is a (-) mark, in the general score.

So, let's see the score that we have:

Bad:
-used mass starvation.
-used forced labor.
-created terror.
-was responsible to the death of millions of people.
- was responsible for the cases of genocide, that is the direct targeting of a certain group, just because it's nationality.
-hurt the socialist movement badly.
- made mistakes during the war.

Good:
-was instrumental in creating an educational and industrial system in the territory of the SU.
- was instrumental in the defeat of Hitler's Germany.
- created an economic model that would support the population of the SU.

Hitler:

Bad:
- Instigated, and commanded an organization that would be the capital reason for the deaths of tens of millions of people in war.
- responsible for the organization of industrialized genocide.
- Created a state of terror in his own country.
- Lowered education levels in germany.
-Went deeply into debth to switzerland.

Good:
-was instrumental in building the autobahn.
- has created an economic basis that would support the people of germany, in the pre-war years.

[St Leo]

"Evil" is a meaningless catchall word. We should be having a discussion about Stalin being "murderous" or "stupid" or "bloodthirsty".

[DuncanK]

I don't think Stalin set back Communism. Russia created an amazing steal industry under Stalin

[Az]

amazing steal industry

[Sandman]

Stalin was a monster. Everything good he did by accident, everything bad he did by design.

[Az]

Stalin was a moron, and he didn't care for the welfare of people. They had the opportunity to create something really big after WWII. But NOOOO we have to have the largest standing army on earth....

[David Floyd]

was instrumental in the defeat of Hitler's Germany.

I take issue with that. Germany was doomed once the US entered the war, regardless of what the Soviet Union did.

[Az]

I take issue with that. Germany was doomed once the US entered the war, regardless of what the Soviet Union did.

no way I am going to enter this discussion.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by DuncanK
I don't think Stalin set back Communism. Russia created an amazing steal industry under Stalin

hehe, oops I mean steel. Well he did steal

[David Floyd]

OK, OK we'll save it for another thread.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Azazel
Stalin was a moron, and he didn't care for the welfare of people. They had the opportunity to create something really big after WWII. But NOOOO we have to have the largest standing army on earth....

But he did create something big. Just imagine if he had better priorities and he wasn't so paranoid about the Imperialists.

[Joseph]

Yes

[JCG]

Stalin wasn't a moron, but he could be incredibly paranoic (and thus became a bloody murderer)..."evil" is just a nice way of oversimplifying it, but whatever.

[St Leo]

Germany was doomed once the US entered the war, regardless of what the Soviet Union did.

Okay, let's assume that the entire Soviet Union swears allegiance to Hitler in 1941 (and Hitler doesn't order one half to kill the other). There's no way the US could beat them without nukes. Will they be the first to get them?

[Shi Huangdi]

Originally posted by St Leo
Germany was doomed once the US entered the war, regardless of what the Soviet Union did.

Okay, let's assume that the entire Soviet Union swears allegiance to Hitler in 1941 (and Hitler doesn't order one half to kill the other). There's no way the US could beat them without nukes. Will they be the first to get them?

yep, and then europe becomes a radioactive wasteland.