US abandoning plans to bring democracy to Iraq, say Kurds

[DanS]

Bush's plan seems emminently reasonable to me. Most economic activity resides with the state in Iraq and that must not be destroyed. Over the long-run, we'll work out the redistribution of power in a more democratic fashion and then the division of money.

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Maybe the PKK can stage a massive uprising when the war begins.

Maybe, maybe not.

We screwed up (actually got our ass kicked by CIA and Mossad) in trying to rescue their leader.

But that in fact worked in PKK's favor. Made them more determined

Their bases have been relocated in a location close to Turkey (will try to find the link).

Perhaps they could do it but I don't think so.
Of course we'll help as much as it doesn't hurt us.

[Andrew1999]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Maybe the PKK can stage a massive uprising when the war begins.

Well a good part of the Turkish army will be there to crush it if it does.

[DanS]

Paiktis: Actually, I think there are parrallels. Not perfect, but Iraq is a functioning state that has it's **** together more than many others.

[Bereta_Eder]

You don't want to rebuild. You want to suck dry, you know it. Same in Afganistan. That's why Euros don't trust Bush. He hasn't got staying power and can't deal with real issues.

BTW Che, what do you know

ISTANBUL, Turkey - Turkey's Kurdish rebels on Wednesday urged Kurdish youths to join the guerrillas and said war against Turkey had become inevitable, in a statement carried by a Kurdish news agency.
The announcement marks an important change of position by the rebels, who had declared a unilateral cease-fire in 1999.


The rebels said they "understood that the four-year-old peace process has been choked and that war has become inevitable." The statement also accused Turkey of preparing to occupy northern Iraq to "suppress Kurdish freedom" there.

Can't find the place they relocated though. It was in Ruters, Turkey was urging that country to stop helping them.

Kurds have to fight off the US, Turkey and Iraq. Holy ****. That's ok though. We've done something similar. It's not impossible. But I simply don't think the time for their freedom has come yet.

[DanS]

You don't want to rebuild.

By and large, the Iraqis have the capability and money to do this themselves.

[Bereta_Eder]

The odds are crushing against them but it would help a little bit if they weren't so divided too.

[Bereta_Eder]

Originally posted by DanS
You don't want to rebuild.

By and large, the Iraqis have the capability and money to do this themselves.

What few pennys of oil dollars you might feel charitable enough to leave them?
Not likely.

Besides you don't kill 500.000 people. Period. Actually you can, try it and may God Blesse America if it does

[Bereta_Eder]

In 1999 they were apparently in Iran

Iran accused Turkey on Friday of trying to send troops into its territories and said Iranian forces drove them back. The Turkish soldiers attempted to attack the northwestern border region of Qottur on Thursday, but were pushed back by Iranian forces, the Farsi-language service of the Islamic Republic News Agency quoted an unidentified foreign ministry official as saying.

- Jul 23 1999

Iran accuses Turkish jets of bombing its territory, killing 5 Turkish warplanes attacked targets in northwestern Iran on Sunday, killing five people and wounding 10 others, Iranian media reported. According to the reports, the attack took place in West Azerbaijan province, which borders southeastern Turkey, where Kurdish rebels have been active.

If someone can find a map east and south of Turkey I can probably remember and pinpoint the country PKK uses as a basse now. (according to turkish declarations of course)

[Shi Huangdi]

If the Kurds try to form an independent state/cause too much trouble, Turkish forces will enter the area and restore order.

[Bereta_Eder]

BTW Turkey can pull off a lot of **** with US backing huh?

[Timexwatch]

I'm wondering why the Kurds think we'll just roll in and then roll out when Saddam is gone. We're not naieve enough think that there won't be widespread score-settling and chaos if we left the Iraqi opposition to its own devices.

Besides, who decides who gets the power? Is it the Kurds? The Shiites in the south? Sunni reps in the central areas? Are we going to let Islamicist parties into the election process?

These are all questions that we need to sort out. Passing off the reigns of power to disparate Kurdish groups is not a good idea. I'm also skeptical of the Expats who are waiting in the wings in the U.S. in Europe. Who says that they are the legitimate government of Iraq?

[Ned]

I believe the Turks may be about to shoot themselves in the foot. They have asked for guarantees about the Kurds from Bush in exchange for using their territory for the invasion of northern Iraq. However, they also want a lot of money from United States, far more than we're willing to give them. This may force Bush to revise his plans regarding the Kurds because we may need their help to stage operation from their territory if we cannot go through Turkey.

In other words, if Turkey doesn't play poker almost immediately, the Turks may end up in major losers in this because they will get neither our money nor the suppression of the Kurds for which they have been bargaining.

[Bereta_Eder]

Well my guess is that the Iraqi Kurds won't be too happy to relinquish their new found freedom there.
In Turkey they are massacred with US backing. In Iraq they are almost free with US backing.
Cute.

Still PKK bases are in neither of these countries now.

[Bereta_Eder]

Ned, yep by all accounts Turkey is in a tough spot right now. We'll see how it'll play out.